Bear Down Wildcats

We need to all head to social media right now and start talking about how we’ll never beat ASU again and that they’ll dominate the PAC South for the next decade if they hire Herm.

LOL!!

One football fan dubbed him “Herm Backwards

https://www.azcentral.com/story/sports/ ... 903807001/" target="_blank

I liked use Fraud and Toad but backwards and variants of Germ will work for me.

Lol embarrassing for them. Love it

247 saying it is Herm Edwards pending Crow approval

No way they hire that guy. That report has to be incorrect

azcat49 wrote:No way they hire that guy. That report has to be incorrect

This twitter thread is awesome.

Lol...that's a garbage hire. Lol

Really gonna excite the fan base.

Wow. You know Tomey said be careful what you wish for when we canned him and that has proven true. Hard to fathom this guy wins the press conference and performs better than CTG

azgreg wrote:

azcat49 wrote:No way they hire that guy. That report has to be incorrect

This twitter thread is awesome.

Thanks for the laugh!

To think they paid 11-12 million dollars to hire a worse coach.

What is this, bring in a figure head on the sideline and let the real coaches coach? Has JoePa returned from the grave?

So fuckin weird. And great.

Looks like Anderson wants Napier to eventually be the HC and is using Edwards to keep the seat warm and help him get ready. Weird.

I can't believe this is actually happening, haha.

And yes, WEIRD is the operative word. We're having to figure out too much.

Like why Herm Edwards? Because Ray A used to be Herm's NFL Agent? ohh...

And why is it so important that the assistants stay on staff? Someone help me.

Does ASU have enough fans for an impromptu protest?

Good chance Anderson and Edwards get canned within the same calendar year.

This is like a mackovik hire

Except machovik had more buzz

I want to know who the boosters are that are ponying up the cash to pay the buyout and pay Edwards to basically be sideline candy. Because they have just reached levels of Sun Devil never seen before.

So. Weird.

Unbelievable.

Herm Edwards is "Walking Cadaver II"...........Dennis Erickson was #1.

Although in Ericksons defense he was better pickled.

Erickson was successful! He even won at Idaho, let alone the absolute juggernaut he piloted at Miami. It was a perfectly defensible hire for ASU to make, no one knew that he was already just a corpse at that point.

splitsecond wrote:I want to know who the boosters are that are ponying up the cash to pay the buyout and pay Edwards to basically be sideline candy. Because they have just reached levels of Sun Devil never seen before.

That's the thing, Ray Anderson was asked how we are paying for Graham's buyout and he was emphatic that there would be no booster money, no tax dollars, and no student fee money used for this buyout. He actually said its on him to "figure it out", but gave no specifics other then telling us what money would not be used. We are generally confused as to how he plans on paying for all of this. One thing is clear, he has been planning this for awhile, and its been handled like an absolute cluster fuck.

Anderson fired a coach who was arguably the second best coach in program history, and had just finished second in the PAC after going 6-3 and was going to return most of the team and his assistants were all returning. After firing him, Anderson states that he expects ASU to be a top 15 program and finish in the top 3 of the conference every year (never mind you he publicly reprimanded Graham for talking like this last year, and that no program outside of maybe 4 programs in the nation actually accomplish this). He also states that while ASU expects top 15 football program results, we are not going to above the average salary for a PAC coach, but believes we will be attractive to top coaches because the PAC is unique in the environment it offers or some bullshit. Basically, "hey yeah we aren't even going to try and compete with Big 10 or SEC salaries, but we think coaches will choose us because they would prefer to live in Tempe over Tuscaloosa or Columbus".

Then after all that, he pushes to hire a guy who has not coached in 10 years, where he was a failed NFL coach. College experience? Yeah Herm Edwards has not been on a college field since Nam. And to really round it all out, Anderson wants whoever the new coach is to keep all of the current staff, in particular the OC and DC. How does that make sense? For one, any coach worth a damn will not be ok with that. And two, hiring assistants is arguably the most important job of a HC. You just fired TG, but want to keep his most important actions as a head coach? So why did you fire him?

If you guys can't tell, I find this to be a fucking disaster. Pop open a cold one and enjoy the shit show. The only way I can think to explain this is they are trying a whole new model of running a program. A model where the HC is a shitty tv personality and he can sell the program and close recruits (I doubt recruits even know who he is.) A model where the rest of the coaching staff are given a lot more authority to simply coach while the HC is out in front of the cameras. It wont work. I really thought no one could possibly be worse than Lisa Love. Ray Anderson just asked the fan base to hold his beer.

I appreciate the honesty

Yikes. Dan Patrick was just laughing at the oddity of this. Was trying to be positive but couldn't help but chuckle

i have a horrible feeling that they'll back away from this between now and the weekend because of backlash

plz no

Scummy Dick Douglas wrote:

splitsecond wrote:I want to know who the boosters are that are ponying up the cash to pay the buyout and pay Edwards to basically be sideline candy. Because they have just reached levels of Sun Devil never seen before.

That's the thing, Ray Anderson was asked how we are paying for Graham's buyout and he was emphatic that there would be no booster money, no tax dollars, and no student fee money used for this buyout. He actually said its on him to "figure it out", but gave no specifics other then telling us what money would not be used. We are generally confused as to how he plans on paying for all of this. One thing is clear, he has been planning this for awhile, and its been handled like an absolute cluster fuck.

Anderson fired a coach who was arguably the second best coach in program history, and had just finished second in the PAC after going 6-3 and was going to return most of the team and his assistants were all returning. After firing him, Anderson states that he expects ASU to be a top 15 program and finish in the top 3 of the conference every year (never mind you he publicly reprimanded Graham for talking like this last year, and that no program outside of maybe 4 programs in the nation actually accomplish this). He also states that while ASU expects top 15 football program results, we are not going to above the average salary for a PAC coach, but believes we will be attractive to top coaches because the PAC is unique in the environment it offers or some bullshit. Basically, "hey yeah we aren't even going to try and compete with Big 10 or SEC salaries, but we think coaches will choose us because they would prefer to live in Tempe over Tuscaloosa or Columbus".

Then after all that, he pushes to hire a guy who has not coached in 10 years, where he was a failed NFL coach. College experience? Yeah Herm Edwards has not been on a college field since Nam. And to really round it all out, Anderson wants whoever the new coach is to keep all of the current staff, in particular the OC and DC. How does that make sense? For one, any coach worth a damn will not be ok with that. And two, hiring assistants is arguably the most important job of a HC. You just fired TG, but want to keep his most important actions as a head coach? So why did you fire him?

If you guys can't tell, I find this to be a fucking disaster. Pop open a cold one and enjoy the shit show. The only way I can think to explain this is they are trying a whole new model of running a program. A model where the HC is a shitty tv personality and he can sell the program and close recruits (I doubt recruits even know who he is.) A model where the rest of the coaching staff are given a lot more authority to simply coach while the HC is out in front of the cameras. It wont work. I really thought no one could possibly be worse than Lisa Love. Ray Anderson just asked the fan base to hold his beer.

This is the type of commentary I am looking for on this message board. Great post. It is refreshing after all of the AZ football hate posts I read here.

RondaeShimmy wrote:i have a horrible feeling that they'll back away from this between now and the weekend because of backlash

plz no

It's all up to Crow at this point, but either way the damage has already been done. This type of deal was in the works for at least a month, and if it's gotten this far, it's something Crow would've known about and approved from the start. Even if this somehow falls through, Ray is back to square one and completely unprepared for the uphill battle it will be to hire enough of an upgrade that justifies paying Graham $12 Million to go away.

Scummy Dick Douglas wrote:If you guys can't tell, I find this to be a fucking disaster.

As you can tell, we are enjoying this immensely. I thought we were going into the offseason without the territorial cup, saddled with a mediocre coach who can’t win big games, and with your team on the upswing. The first two are obviously still true, but this Herm Edwards thing is a joy to behold.

A friend of mine said that the ASU AD took a loan out from the University to pay for the buyout.

The buyout money is mind boggling. The hire just doesnt compute. Yes he is a TV personality and that might impress some parents but I doubt kids would remember who he is. Todd was the best and selling ocean property in Arizona so how does this help them. Maybe it works out but I think nationally people will laugh and forget. If UA did this, I would write a lot of well written letters!

Honestly can say I hate ASU a little less now.

So does Anderson negotiate with himself on the contract and then take 10% once Edwards signs?

While he is on TV, “personality” might be giving him too much credit.

CatsbyAZ wrote:

RondaeShimmy wrote:i have a horrible feeling that they'll back away from this between now and the weekend because of backlash

plz no

It's all up to Crow at this point, but either way the damage has already been done. This type of deal was in the works for at least a month, and if it's gotten this far, it's something Crow would've known about and approved from the start. Even if this somehow falls through, Ray is back to square one and completely unprepared for the uphill battle it will be to hire enough of an upgrade that justifies paying Graham $12 Million to go away.

Most signs indicate this has been in the works since before the season. I don't think Ray was expecting the season to unfold the way it did, so he might have expected a lot less push back than he will now get. From what I have heard from peeps in the AD, Ray has a vision to roll out an unconventional concept that he thinks will change the paradigm of college ball. Its apparently not simply just the hire of Edwards, but a complete shift of resources and restructuring of the program towards recruiting. I think they are going trying to put together something similar to what Alabama has in hiring a ton of "advisors" to support a revamped and heavily resourced recruiting department. Seems like Ray believes a HC's main job is to sell the program and be a CEO type. The actual coaching should be left to all the assistants.

Not sure why they couldn't have invested in restructuring the recruiting department under Graham, but what do I know. This entire plan hinges on their ability to retain certain assistant coaches and/or go out and hire top tier assistants. Those types of hires usually hinge on the HC's relationships. I am skeptical a guy who has been out of coaching for 10 years has much of a coaching network to draw from.

Scummy Dick Douglas wrote:

splitsecond wrote:I want to know who the boosters are that are ponying up the cash to pay the buyout and pay Edwards to basically be sideline candy. Because they have just reached levels of Sun Devil never seen before.

That's the thing, Ray Anderson was asked how we are paying for Graham's buyout and he was emphatic that there would be no booster money, no tax dollars, and no student fee money used for this buyout. He actually said its on him to "figure it out", but gave no specifics other then telling us what money would not be used. We are generally confused as to how he plans on paying for all of this. One thing is clear, he has been planning this for awhile, and its been handled like an absolute cluster fuck.

Anderson fired a coach who was arguably the second best coach in program history, and had just finished second in the PAC after going 6-3 and was going to return most of the team and his assistants were all returning. After firing him, Anderson states that he expects ASU to be a top 15 program and finish in the top 3 of the conference every year (never mind you he publicly reprimanded Graham for talking like this last year, and that no program outside of maybe 4 programs in the nation actually accomplish this). He also states that while ASU expects top 15 football program results, we are not going to above the average salary for a PAC coach, but believes we will be attractive to top coaches because the PAC is unique in the environment it offers or some bullshit. Basically, "hey yeah we aren't even going to try and compete with Big 10 or SEC salaries, but we think coaches will choose us because they would prefer to live in Tempe over Tuscaloosa or Columbus".

Then after all that, he pushes to hire a guy who has not coached in 10 years, where he was a failed NFL coach. College experience? Yeah Herm Edwards has not been on a college field since Nam. And to really round it all out, Anderson wants whoever the new coach is to keep all of the current staff, in particular the OC and DC. How does that make sense? For one, any coach worth a damn will not be ok with that. And two, hiring assistants is arguably the most important job of a HC. You just fired TG, but want to keep his most important actions as a head coach? So why did you fire him?

If you guys can't tell, I find this to be a fucking disaster. Pop open a cold one and enjoy the shit show. The only way I can think to explain this is they are trying a whole new model of running a program. A model where the HC is a shitty tv personality and he can sell the program and close recruits (I doubt recruits even know who he is.) A model where the rest of the coaching staff are given a lot more authority to simply coach while the HC is out in front of the cameras. It wont work. I really thought no one could possibly be worse than Lisa Love. Ray Anderson just asked the fan base to hold his beer.

I will say this: the way it has gone down and the somewhat surprising grace that CTG has showed through all of it makes me feel for the guy, and to a lesser extent, ASU fans. A much lesser extent of course

Scummy Dick Douglas wrote:

CatsbyAZ wrote:

RondaeShimmy wrote:i have a horrible feeling that they'll back away from this between now and the weekend because of backlash

plz no

It's all up to Crow at this point, but either way the damage has already been done. This type of deal was in the works for at least a month, and if it's gotten this far, it's something Crow would've known about and approved from the start. Even if this somehow falls through, Ray is back to square one and completely unprepared for the uphill battle it will be to hire enough of an upgrade that justifies paying Graham $12 Million to go away.

Most signs indicate this has been in the works since before the season. I don't think Ray was expecting the season to unfold the way it did, so he might have expected a lot less push back than he will now get. From what I have heard from peeps in the AD, Ray has a vision to roll out an unconventional concept that he thinks will change the paradigm of college ball. Its apparently not simply just the hire of Edwards, but a complete shift of resources and restructuring of the program towards recruiting. I think they are going trying to put together something similar to what Alabama has in hiring a ton of "advisors" to support a revamped and heavily resourced recruiting department. Seems like Ray believes a HC's main job is to sell the program and be a CEO type. The actual coaching should be left to all the assistants.

Not sure why they couldn't have invested in restructuring the recruiting department under Graham, but what do I know. This entire plan hinges on their ability to retain certain assistant coaches and/or go out and hire top tier assistants. Those types of hires usually hinge on the HC's relationships. I am skeptical a guy who has been out of coaching for 10 years has much of a coaching network to draw from.

It is certainly an interesting approach, but the problem is its very high risk / high reward. Ultimately Alabama still has a head coach who is the brains of the operation and the center of loyalty to the program. You run a really high risk of recruit turnover and instability as the guys under Herm Edwards leave to take head coaching positions or higher up positions at schools with higher budgets. I think the concept can work, but I don't think ASU is the school for it, but more importantly, I don't think Herm is the right figurehead.

splitsecond wrote:

Scummy Dick Douglas wrote:

CatsbyAZ wrote:

RondaeShimmy wrote:i have a horrible feeling that they'll back away from this between now and the weekend because of backlash

plz no

It's all up to Crow at this point, but either way the damage has already been done. This type of deal was in the works for at least a month, and if it's gotten this far, it's something Crow would've known about and approved from the start. Even if this somehow falls through, Ray is back to square one and completely unprepared for the uphill battle it will be to hire enough of an upgrade that justifies paying Graham $12 Million to go away.

Most signs indicate this has been in the works since before the season. I don't think Ray was expecting the season to unfold the way it did, so he might have expected a lot less push back than he will now get. From what I have heard from peeps in the AD, Ray has a vision to roll out an unconventional concept that he thinks will change the paradigm of college ball. Its apparently not simply just the hire of Edwards, but a complete shift of resources and restructuring of the program towards recruiting. I think they are going trying to put together something similar to what Alabama has in hiring a ton of "advisors" to support a revamped and heavily resourced recruiting department. Seems like Ray believes a HC's main job is to sell the program and be a CEO type. The actual coaching should be left to all the assistants.

Not sure why they couldn't have invested in restructuring the recruiting department under Graham, but what do I know. This entire plan hinges on their ability to retain certain assistant coaches and/or go out and hire top tier assistants. Those types of hires usually hinge on the HC's relationships. I am skeptical a guy who has been out of coaching for 10 years has much of a coaching network to draw from.

It is certainly an interesting approach, but the problem is its very high risk / high reward. Ultimately Alabama still has a head coach who is the brains of the operation and the center of loyalty to the program. You run a really high risk of recruit turnover and instability as the guys under Herm Edwards leave to take head coaching positions or higher up positions at schools with higher budgets. I think the concept can work, but I don't think ASU is the school for it, but more importantly, I don't think Herm is the right figurehead.

Herm is not the right guy for it. The HC's most important job is hiring coaches. Who the hell is Herm going to hire? There is no way he has any sort of effective network to lean on, which is the biggest reason this will fail.

splitsecond wrote:

Scummy Dick Douglas wrote:

splitsecond wrote:I want to know who the boosters are that are ponying up the cash to pay the buyout and pay Edwards to basically be sideline candy. Because they have just reached levels of Sun Devil never seen before.

That's the thing, Ray Anderson was asked how we are paying for Graham's buyout and he was emphatic that there would be no booster money, no tax dollars, and no student fee money used for this buyout. He actually said its on him to "figure it out", but gave no specifics other then telling us what money would not be used. We are generally confused as to how he plans on paying for all of this. One thing is clear, he has been planning this for awhile, and its been handled like an absolute cluster fuck.

Anderson fired a coach who was arguably the second best coach in program history, and had just finished second in the PAC after going 6-3 and was going to return most of the team and his assistants were all returning. After firing him, Anderson states that he expects ASU to be a top 15 program and finish in the top 3 of the conference every year (never mind you he publicly reprimanded Graham for talking like this last year, and that no program outside of maybe 4 programs in the nation actually accomplish this). He also states that while ASU expects top 15 football program results, we are not going to above the average salary for a PAC coach, but believes we will be attractive to top coaches because the PAC is unique in the environment it offers or some bullshit. Basically, "hey yeah we aren't even going to try and compete with Big 10 or SEC salaries, but we think coaches will choose us because they would prefer to live in Tempe over Tuscaloosa or Columbus".

Then after all that, he pushes to hire a guy who has not coached in 10 years, where he was a failed NFL coach. College experience? Yeah Herm Edwards has not been on a college field since Nam. And to really round it all out, Anderson wants whoever the new coach is to keep all of the current staff, in particular the OC and DC. How does that make sense? For one, any coach worth a damn will not be ok with that. And two, hiring assistants is arguably the most important job of a HC. You just fired TG, but want to keep his most important actions as a head coach? So why did you fire him?

If you guys can't tell, I find this to be a fucking disaster. Pop open a cold one and enjoy the shit show. The only way I can think to explain this is they are trying a whole new model of running a program. A model where the HC is a shitty tv personality and he can sell the program and close recruits (I doubt recruits even know who he is.) A model where the rest of the coaching staff are given a lot more authority to simply coach while the HC is out in front of the cameras. It wont work. I really thought no one could possibly be worse than Lisa Love. Ray Anderson just asked the fan base to hold his beer.

I will say this: the way it has gone down and the somewhat surprising grace that CTG has showed through all of it makes me feel for the guy, and to a lesser extent, ASU fans. A much lesser extent of course

CTG was a class act throughout the firing. Watch his press conference and compare it to Ray Anderson's. One was a consummate professional. The other came across defensive and arrogant (not to mention he showed up wearing a fucking track suit).

Scummy Dick Douglas wrote:
Most signs indicate this has been in the works since before the season. I don't think Ray was expecting the season to unfold the way it did, so he might have expected a lot less push back than he will now get. From what I have heard from peeps in the AD, Ray has a vision to roll out an unconventional concept that he thinks will change the paradigm of college ball. Its apparently not simply just the hire of Edwards, but a complete shift of resources and restructuring of the program towards recruiting. I think they are going trying to put together something similar to what Alabama has in hiring a ton of "advisors" to support a revamped and heavily resourced recruiting department. Seems like Ray believes a HC's main job is to sell the program and be a CEO type. The actual coaching should be left to all the assistants.

Not sure why they couldn't have invested in restructuring the recruiting department under Graham, but what do I know. This entire plan hinges on their ability to retain certain assistant coaches and/or go out and hire top tier assistants. Those types of hires usually hinge on the HC's relationships. I am skeptical a guy who has been out of coaching for 10 years has much of a coaching network to draw from.

Thanks SDD, that explains a lot. As for why this wasn't done under Graham, is it likely Ray tried? But since most high level HCs are Type A Control Freaks, Graham absolutely refused? Graham gave ASU 100% during his time in Tempe, but it's that same all-in nature that also made him very difficult for the athletic department to work with.

CatsbyAZ wrote:

Scummy Dick Douglas wrote:
Most signs indicate this has been in the works since before the season. I don't think Ray was expecting the season to unfold the way it did, so he might have expected a lot less push back than he will now get. From what I have heard from peeps in the AD, Ray has a vision to roll out an unconventional concept that he thinks will change the paradigm of college ball. Its apparently not simply just the hire of Edwards, but a complete shift of resources and restructuring of the program towards recruiting. I think they are going trying to put together something similar to what Alabama has in hiring a ton of "advisors" to support a revamped and heavily resourced recruiting department. Seems like Ray believes a HC's main job is to sell the program and be a CEO type. The actual coaching should be left to all the assistants.

Not sure why they couldn't have invested in restructuring the recruiting department under Graham, but what do I know. This entire plan hinges on their ability to retain certain assistant coaches and/or go out and hire top tier assistants. Those types of hires usually hinge on the HC's relationships. I am skeptical a guy who has been out of coaching for 10 years has much of a coaching network to draw from.

Thanks SDD, that explains a lot. As for why this wasn't done under Graham, is it likely Ray tried? But since most high level HCs are Type A Control Freaks, Graham absolutely refused? Graham gave ASU 100% during his time in Tempe, but it's that same all-in nature that also made him very difficult for the athletic department to work with.

Not from what I have been told. Besides, who refuses an infusion of money into their recruiting? All evidence points to Ray Anderson working towards this for some time now. It is my understanding he wanted to fire him last year but did not have the support of Crow or the major boosters. Most of the major boosters are still not necessarily on board, but he has Crow on board now (assuming he is not convinced otherwise this weekend). While this has not been popular, it has not reached the level of panic that surfaced in response to the pursuit of June Jones. ASU basically backed into Graham because boosters/fans came out strongly against Crow and Patterson nearly signing June.

Thanks for posting SDD. Holy shit man, that's crazy. This must be what Russia feels like to watch our Democracy crumble...only we didn't conspire to put Herm in place. Or did we?.....HUHUHHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHA.

Official on Monday. Throw a big party. Since 6-6 teams get into bowls it probably won't lead to a 10 year bowlless streak but i can hope

Gilbertcat wrote:Official on Monday. Throw a big party. Since 6-6 teams get into bowls it probably won't lead to a 10 year bowlless streak but i can hope

Scummy Dick Douglas wrote:Most signs indicate this has been in the works since before the season. I don't think Ray was expecting the season to unfold the way it did, so he might have expected a lot less push back than he will now get. From what I have heard from peeps in the AD, Ray has a vision to roll out an unconventional concept that he thinks will change the paradigm of college ball. Its apparently not simply just the hire of Edwards, but a complete shift of resources and restructuring of the program towards recruiting. I think they are going trying to put together something similar to what Alabama has in hiring a ton of "advisors" to support a revamped and heavily resourced recruiting department. Seems like Ray believes a HC's main job is to sell the program and be a CEO type. The actual coaching should be left to all the assistants.

Interesting. I think we should also move to a CEO type model (a model that would also be an unconventional concept), but it sounds like my theoretical model would look quite a bit different and have different focuses.

Not sure why they couldn't have invested in restructuring the recruiting department under Graham, but what do I know. This entire plan hinges on their ability to retain certain assistant coaches and/or go out and hire top tier assistants. Those types of hires usually hinge on the HC's relationships. I am skeptical a guy who has been out of coaching for 10 years has much of a coaching network to draw from.

LOL well actually this is starting to look like my model quite a bit; that is, the focus on high level (and highly paid) assistants.

It will be interesting to see how it works out.

Gilbertcat wrote:Official on Monday. Throw a big party. Since 6-6 teams get into bowls it probably won't lead to a 10 year bowlless streak but i can hope

So with the official announcement tomorrow Tempe was given what? - 10 to 12 days to revolt? The only dissent I heard was from a few of the usual message board crazies and a few national media talkers - Dan Patrick, Mike Wilbon - offering iffy reactions before rushing on to bigger sports stories. I just can't believe this hire is actually happening. Every bit as wacky as Kansas hiring Charlie Weis or Washington hiring Ty Willingham to name a few.

So. Weird.

CatsbyAZ wrote:

Gilbertcat wrote:Official on Monday. Throw a big party. Since 6-6 teams get into bowls it probably won't lead to a 10 year bowlless streak but i can hope

So with the official announcement tomorrow Tempe was given what? - 10 to 12 days to revolt? The only dissent I heard was from a few of the usual message board crazies and a few national media talkers - Dan Patrick, Mike Wilbon - offering iffy reactions before rushing on to bigger sports stories. I just can't believe this hire is actually happening. Every bit as wacky as Kansas hiring Charlie Weis or Washington hiring Ty Willingham to name a few.

It's not necessarily weird if they're doing the out of the box thought idea that was alluded to above.

In my own "create a plan for repeating fringe top 10 success for Arizona football" outside of the box brainstorm I had someone like Dick Tomey (not necessarily Dick himself, as he's 79) coming in to be the football CEO.

It really depends on how serious they are about tying to create success outside of the normal college football thinking process.