Today's win

Chicat · Post by **Chicat** » Sat Dec 05, 2015 4:48 pm

Reminded me of our comeback against Kansas in 2003.

Obviously the point swing wasn't as dramatic, but I thought our grit and determination not to lose was even better.

True non-conference road wins against top-15 competition are worth gold come March. Great win!

Beachcat97 · Post by **Beachcat97** » Sat Dec 05, 2015 4:59 pm

Funny how it's "Go Zags" for the rest of the season.

HiCat · Post by **HiCat** » Sat Dec 05, 2015 5:04 pm

Arizona's second-half spurt stuns Kyle Wiltjer, Gonzaga

After a first half that went exactly as Gonzaga planned, the second half revealed an Arizona team good enough to contain the nation's best scorer, demoralize a raucous home crowd, erase a 10-point halftime deficit, and leave Spokane with a massively impressive win.

http://espn.go.com/blog/collegebasketba ... er-gonzaga" target="_blank

Spaceman Spiff · Post by **Spaceman Spiff** » Sat Dec 05, 2015 5:14 pm

Beachcat97 wrote:Funny how it's "Go Zags" for the rest of the season.

Why? I hope Karnowski gets healthy soon and Zaga pulls the undefeated conference season.

This game was a great sign for the mental makeup of this team. We are young and developing, and there will still be tough times. This is how you fight through them and develop for March, though.

gumby · Post by **gumby** » Sat Dec 05, 2015 6:31 pm

Stunned at the lack of discussion about this game. Great fucking victory in a very tough environment. I was near a bunch of Arizona fans. Surprised at how many were there. Bear down, baby.

Tarc out. Anderson hobbled. Down 14. Seemingly no answer for Wiltjer.

Miller recognizes the weakness of the Zag guards. Adjusts, yes, adjusts by ramping up pressure on guards. Changes the whole game. York and Trier take over.

Gutty, gritty, great win. If you were there and heard the roar of the Zag crowd, you would not think it was possible.

Great day to be a Wildcat.

carolinacat · Post by **carolinacat** » Sat Dec 05, 2015 6:51 pm

Chicat wrote:Reminded me of our comeback against Kansas in 2003.

Obviously the point swing wasn't as dramatic, but I thought our grit and determination not to lose was even better.

True non-conference road wins against top-15 competition are worth gold come March. Great win!

I was at the Kansas game in '03. Nice comparison. York channeled his inner Salim in the second half to light the fire.

If you're an outside shooter, the best time to get hot is in the second half. It can really swing the momentum of a game and once you cool off, it's too late for the other team to bounce back.

carolinacat · Post by **carolinacat** » Sat Dec 05, 2015 6:53 pm

gumby wrote:Stunned at the lack of discussion about this game. Great fucking victory in a very tough environment. I was near a bunch of Arizona fans. Surprised at how many were there. Bear down, baby.

Tarc out. Anderson hobbled. Down 14. Seemingly no answer for Wiltjer.

Miller recognizes the weakness of the Zag guards. Adjusts, yes, adjusts by ramping up pressure on guards. Changes the whole game. York and Trier take over.

Gutty, gritty, great win. If you were there and heard the roar of the Zag crowd, you would not think it was possible.

Great day to be a Wildcat.

I applaud the adjustments by Miller. But really, everyone and their second cousin knew that Gonzaga was a 2-player team going into this game. The strategy from the get-go should have been to make Gonzaga's guards beat you. Maybe it was just our lack of execution in the first half. If I was a Zags fan, I'd be demoralized. Not only did you lose a game you should've won, but you also know your backcourt is your achilles heal and most good teams are gonna exploit the crap out of it.

legallykenny · Post by **legallykenny** » Sat Dec 05, 2015 7:17 pm

Another big game, another loss for Few. Would be nice if we could stop pretending that program is any good just because it beats up on other teams full of Mark Tollefsens every year.

Few will never win anything of note until he commits to coaching defense.

azcat49 · Post by **azcat49** » Sat Dec 05, 2015 7:21 pm

Few couldn't win the pan American Games either even though he had some older guys and I think some D league guys

84Cat · Post by **84Cat** » Sat Dec 05, 2015 7:33 pm

Ryan Hansen was yapping on the radio the 1st half that we needed more pressure on the guards. Glad we made the adjustment

AZCatGirl · Post by **AZCatGirl** » Sat Dec 05, 2015 7:42 pm

azcat49 wrote:Few couldn't win the pan American Games either even though he had some older guys and I think some D league guys

He couldn't even make the title game while Miller won gold with a bunch of young players.

KaibabKat · Post by **KaibabKat** » Sat Dec 05, 2015 7:52 pm

Well, could it be partly due to his big 7' Center getting worse and worse with each game played?

CalStateTempe · Post by **CalStateTempe** » Sat Dec 05, 2015 7:56 pm

Any way on gods green earth I can catch a reply?

Stupid driving to the sierras to cut a damn tree and assumed it was a night/late afternoon game.

Missed the whole thing and forgot to record it. ugh.

ASUHATER! · Post by **ASUHATER!** » Sat Dec 05, 2015 7:58 pm

Full game is on watch ESPN. Just log in with your TV provider

Catintheheat · Post by **Catintheheat** » Sat Dec 05, 2015 7:58 pm

CalStateTempe wrote:Any way on gods green earth I can catch a reply?

Stupid driving to the sierras to cut a damn tree and assumed it was a night/late afternoon game.

Missed the whole thing and forgot to record it. ugh.

As long as you have espn you can find the replay on WatchESPN.

CalStateTempe · Post by **CalStateTempe** » Sat Dec 05, 2015 8:25 pm

Sweet! Thanks CITH

eoe · Post by **eoe** » Sat Dec 05, 2015 8:43 pm

I must say this is a top 5 regular season win in Sean Miller's career at Zona. I know thing's really weren't as bad as they seemed with us losing a very close game to a top 25 team without our most important player, but we really needed this win come March Madness for seeding. Certainly not Miller's strongest team at Zona, however you don't need to be the most talented to win the NCAA or make a F4. Gabe York was clutch and Trier keeps scoring without anyone noticing.

EOCT · Post by **EOCT** » Sun Dec 06, 2015 4:31 am

gumby wrote:Stunned at the lack of discussion about this game. Great fucking victory in a very tough environment. I was near a bunch of Arizona fans. Surprised at how many were there. Bear down, baby.

Tarc out. Anderson hobbled. Down 14. Seemingly no answer for Wiltjer.

Miller recognizes the weakness of the Zag guards. Adjusts, yes, adjusts by ramping up pressure on guards. Changes the whole game. York and Trier take over.

Gutty, gritty, great win. If you were there and heard the roar of the Zag crowd, you would not think it was possible.

Great day to be a Wildcat.

!

HiCat · Post by **HiCat** » Sun Dec 06, 2015 6:16 am

What a game. In the first half I wondered if this might be the makings of a blowout game. Zags made shots look easy. Gabe's shot was cold, RA not doing better on his ankle. (but he didn't practice all week, so I thought okay, not bad considering). Nothing seemed to work. The refs sure did their part to give the dogs help with phantom calls on Pitts, and no calls on PJC. Oh yeah, and they robbed Gabe on that weird "no basket" call. Grrrrr. But I never had the feeling that Cats were out of it. In fact, you sort of knew they'd come back. And they did big time.

Miller made outstanding adjustments, and the rest was beautiful. Gabe started shooting big time, Trier kept getting to the hoop, the Cats defense tightened up, and got it done.

Great game boys!

Olsondogg · Post by **Olsondogg** » Sun Dec 06, 2015 7:07 am

I love looking back at my Twitter feed with a min left in first half. So many with so little faith. Copious tweets about rich rod leaving and bball sucking

Beachcat97 · Post by **Beachcat97** » Sun Dec 06, 2015 8:41 am

Still can't believe we got this one sans Zeus. Even with Gonzaga's big man out, we're a different team without our guy.

Olsondogg · Post by **Olsondogg** » Sun Dec 06, 2015 9:05 am

I can't believe that you were wrong!

Merkin · Post by **Merkin** » Sun Dec 06, 2015 10:11 am

gumby wrote: I was near a bunch of Arizona fans. Surprised at how many were there.

Nice to hear: YOUUUU OF AAAAYE YOUUUU OF AAAAYE at such a distant and hostile location.

gumby · Post by **gumby** » Sun Dec 06, 2015 11:28 am

carolinacat wrote:
gumby wrote:Stunned at the lack of discussion about this game. Great fucking victory in a very tough environment. I was near a bunch of Arizona fans. Surprised at how many were there. Bear down, baby.

Tarc out. Anderson hobbled. Down 14. Seemingly no answer for Wiltjer.

Miller recognizes the weakness of the Zag guards. Adjusts, yes, adjusts by ramping up pressure on guards. Changes the whole game. York and Trier take over.

Gutty, gritty, great win. If you were there and heard the roar of the Zag crowd, you would not think it was possible.

Great day to be a Wildcat.
I applaud the adjustments by Miller. But really, everyone and their second cousin knew that Gonzaga was a 2-player team going into this game. The strategy from the get-go should have been to make Gonzaga's guards beat you. Maybe it was just our lack of execution in the first half. If I was a Zags fan, I'd be demoralized. Not only did you lose a game you should've won, but you also know your backcourt is your achilles heal and most good teams are gonna exploit the crap out of it.

Beat a ranked team at their place with zero starters from last year's team. But only because Miller finally caught up to what "everyone" already knew. Sounds like we won despite Miller.

Fortunately, we went up against a worse coach.

legallykenny wrote:Another big game, another loss for Few. Would be nice if we could stop pretending that program is any good just because it beats up on other teams full of Mark Tollefsens every year.

Few will never win anything of note until he commits to coaching defense.

Tough crowd. Guess that wasn't much an accomplishment, after all.

gumby · Post by **gumby** » Sun Dec 06, 2015 11:31 am

Merkin wrote:
gumby wrote: I was near a bunch of Arizona fans. Surprised at how many were there.
Nice to hear: YOUUUU OF AAAAYE YOUUUU OF AAAAYE at such a distant and hostile location.

And for such a mediocre achievement. We're so easy.

Beachcat97 wrote:Still can't believe we got this one sans Zeus. Even with Gonzaga's big man out, we're a different team without our guy.

Of course you can't believe it. At least tell me you enjoyed all that egg on your face.

Puerco · Post by **Puerco** » Mon Dec 07, 2015 5:38 am

Olsondogg wrote:I love looking back at my Twitter feed with a min left in first half. So many with so little faith. Copious tweets about rich rod leaving and bball sucking

The compuslive need to post foolish sentiments, which can't be taken back, to a global audience in a moment of high stress and emotion is inexplicable. Doing something so stupid in the Stone Ages would've gotten you eaten by a sabertooth tiger before you could reproduce.

rgdeuce · Post by **rgdeuce** » Mon Dec 07, 2015 8:03 am

CalStateTempe wrote:Any way on gods green earth I can catch a reply?
Stupid driving to the sierras to cut a damn tree and assumed it was a night/late afternoon game.
Missed the whole thing and forgot to record it. ugh.

I feel your pain. I was at a holiday party for my wife's work. She told me that morning about it and when I blew a gasket, she was saying she told me weeks back. I would have remembered if her dumbass work scheduled a party on the day of the biggest nonconference game of the year. I told her she better pray we got killed, cuz if I missed a win or a competitive game I was gonna kill her. You should have seen my face as I refreshed my ESPN live feed and saw the final score with 0:00 left.

But I DVR'd it, so at least I got to see how it happened after it happened. Nothing close to the tension and excitement of experiencing it live though.

rgdeuce · Post by **rgdeuce** » Mon Dec 07, 2015 8:16 am

Jesus. Yea the lack of excitement and understanding of what that win meant is really disturbing. I guess the magnitude is being masked by making shitty ass excuses for Gonzaga. People want to blame their back court and "they only have two players." That is what happens when you play a two man game and don't involve the rest of the team. That is why the Lakers and Cavs struggled when Kobe and Lebron would jack 30 plus shots a game while their teammates watched. You don't involve others they aren't going to be in rhythm later, and that is compounded when their legs are tired later in the game. So yeah, their two man game killed us early, but at one point late in the first, those dudes had all but two of Gonzaga's points. We make adjustments and those dudes wore themselves out working so hard early, all of a sudden you want everyone else to step up when they've been eating popcorn on that end of the floor? It goes both ways. They dont play two man early, we arent down 14 early.

A win in that environment is a huge statement. Miller and the team showing they can beat a very strong team, in one of the toughest places to play, against one of the top players in the nation and Sabonis who is just a little bit behind. That may be the hardest 1-2 tandem in college basketball to stop right now. The grit to come back too. That game was close to being over when we were down 14, and it wasn't like we closed that gap quickly after, it took York going HAM in the early second after it hovered in that 10-14 range for a while, just waiting to finally be put away. The defense in the 2nd half was what we have been hoping for, by far the best it has looked all year. People like to shit on York, and yes, consistency is an issue with him, but that is balls of steel there, which we also saw from him in the first Boise State game. Another guy with balls of steel in the 2nd half, Trier, and didn't we see that in the Boise State game too? We won that game without Zeus and with Anderson not having a big game (I am assuming he was only 60-70 percent). Our point guards were horrible from the floor too. We won with grit and defense, and that is what most of us have wanted to see for a while now. And for a team dealing w a crap load of adversity, what does that do for our confidence? It's like swinging a bat with a weight donut on it, Zeus comes back, Anderson gets to full health, guys improve, the donut is off, then we are swinging with a bat that feels like a feather.

Chicat · Post by **Chicat** » Mon Dec 07, 2015 9:33 am

Yeah, I just don't get the notion behind denigrating this win. That "two man team" had five guys on the court at all times. And it was their court (and loud as fuck at that). The Cats could have wilted. Could have run and hid. But instead they pulled out a gutty win a thousand+ miles from home.

I'm still beaming from that game. Guess I have to with so many others treating it like it meant nothing. I'll just go ahead and be a fan for you. You're welcome.

rgdeuce · Post by **rgdeuce** » Mon Dec 07, 2015 10:17 am

Outside of beating Duke in MSG (and mostly because it was Duke), that has been our most satisfying nonconference win in recent years. And probably the most impressive all things considered.

Spaceman Spiff · Post by **Spaceman Spiff** » Mon Dec 07, 2015 10:21 am

If it makes any difference, I'm insanely happy. That game literally could not have been better.

We faced adversity and a dominant performance from Wiltjer and fought our way to a win. It felt like the type of win that defines a team's personality. It was a "this is 2015-16 Arizona" game and it defined us in the best way O could hope for at this point.

We're not a juggernaut yet, but we are a talented team with a deep resolve and ability to rebound from disappointments like Providence.

Bear Down Vegas · Post by **Bear Down Vegas** » Mon Dec 07, 2015 10:26 am

I'm going through a lot of shit in my personal life. A lot. & work sucks too. & it's the holidays. So I've been frequenting the boards way less than usual. I don't even watch the games live very often anymore. I think I watched the game about 4 hours late Saturday.

Part of the reason I've not been as involved is that with everything else going on in my life two things are happening. Sports wins are getting a little less awesome feeling but for some reason - the losses still feel as difficult. That doesn't make sense?

So...the first half was kinda what I expected & though I never thought of not finishing the game, I was pretty bummed about the second half at halftime. I surely lost faith & just wanted to get it over with.

BUT.

That second half was awesome. Just fantastic! I know York got hot but everyone played their hearts out & you could see the entire squad lifting off each other...not one guy. It wasn't really like when Salim or Simon or Damon or Kerr or Elliot would get hot & put the team on their back as much as it felt more like those Geary & Fogg moments to me. Guys who the other players played harder for maybe? York isn't the star of this team (even though ESPN kept inferring he is) - but he is very much the leader & the heart of this team. York haters be damned - that's the truth.

I spent that hour Saturday night in the best mood I've been in, in a long time. It was just great. So much fun. Sorry it took me so long to get in & add to the discussion but that one was one of the many games I will never forget. All time classic.

Go Cats.

Cheers,

BDV

threenumberones · Post by **threenumberones** » Mon Dec 07, 2015 10:59 am

Really sorry to hear BDV. I hope things turn up for you.

Also been distracted and haven't had a chance to chime in. A huge win, no doubt. I was screaming and dancing like a teenage girl during the second half. An amazing series of moments, which you had to struggle through the abyssal first half in order to truly appreciate the most. My colleague has a son at Gonzaga and so the post-game trash talk was epic as well. Hell of a day.

In reflecting though, I feel like the Zags lost it more than we won it. Boo me if you want, but that's my gut feel. They couldn't do anything right after about the 12min mark. Almost nothing. Sure we applied some pressure and did a better job on the glass, but they hit all of those same shots in the first half. It didn't look like our D was THAT much better. More that they got really really cold. There's a difference. Clearly if that was Wiscy they would have kept that first half crap up all game.

To me, the big difference between the first and second half was on O. The Gene Hackman pass-it-four-times-three-man-weave motion O is so damn pacifying for us. So..I don't know, awkward really. Just hurts to watch it. It makes the players numb and mechanical. But in the second half there was an assertiveness that was completely lacking in the first. Guys were actually looking for their own shot. No one wants hero ball, but under Miller we are going to need guys that can see and operate outside of the 'system' to create opportunity. And that was happening over and over again in the second half - especially York and Trier. If you noticed, the offensive sets were less predictable and the plays were more spontaneous. The guys need to recognize opportunities as they unfold more effectively instead of just 'where to pass the ball next'. I hope the coaching staff shows this tape over and over and over again: A tale of two halves, what not to do followed by what we should be doing game in and game out.

It's early in the year so not celebrating quite yet. Pretty damn encouraging though to respond like that in a difficult place to play. I think it's going to be a really fun year watching them grow into their identity on the court.

Spaceman Spiff · Post by **Spaceman Spiff** » Mon Dec 07, 2015 11:27 am

3 x 1's, the offense was much better, but I thought we did better on D too. First half, we couldn't stop Wiltjer and Sabonis from getting where they wanted. We did a vastly better job with Sabonis and turned them into Wiltjer and the guards in the second. That was huge, because Zaga is very front court heavy. Forcing their guards to make plays helped us turn the game.

Yeah, part of it was that their guards didn't capitalize, but making a team rely on its weak links is a huge part of defensive gameplanning. We didn't do that with Providence and Dunn, so the step we took in that direction was good for me.

Jefe · Post by **Jefe** » Mon Dec 07, 2015 4:03 pm

Beachcat97 wrote:Funny how it's "Go Zags" for the rest of the season.

UCLA is up there Saturday...

CalStateTempe wrote:Any way on gods green earth I can catch a reply?

Full game: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZGXDYcWIX9g" target="_blank

legallykenny · Post by **legallykenny** » Mon Dec 07, 2015 9:31 pm

Chicat wrote:Yeah, I just don't get the notion behind denigrating this win. That "two man team" had five guys on the court at all times. And it was their court (and loud as fuck at that). The Cats could have wilted. Could have run and hid. But instead they pulled out a gutty win a thousand+ miles from home.

I'm still beaming from that game. Guess I have to with so many others treating it like it meant nothing. I'll just go ahead and be a fan for you. You're welcome.

I don't like giving a program that has accomplished nothing any credit. Caring about beating a shit team like Gonzaga should be beneath us. Playing MSU last weekend would've meant much, much more to me.
When Gonzaga is inevitably 26-4 in March, just remember that they will have played one ranked team all year and lost to it. At home. Just like every year. Then they'll "shockingly" lose to a lower seed in the round of 32 or 16 in the tournament. Just like every year. So who cares about them?

Chicat · Post by **Chicat** » Mon Dec 07, 2015 10:00 pm

Didn't they go to the Elite 8 last year?

legallykenny · Post by **legallykenny** » Mon Dec 07, 2015 10:24 pm

Chicat wrote:Didn't they go to the Elite 8 last year?

Beating a 15, a 7 and an 11. Mark Few's ONLY Elite Eight trip. Congratulations are truly in order.

Beachcat97 · Post by **Beachcat97** » Mon Dec 07, 2015 11:12 pm

Jefe wrote:
Beachcat97 wrote:Funny how it's "Go Zags" for the rest of the season.
UCLA is up there Saturday...

Yep. Like I said, go Zags.

CalStateTempe · Post by **CalStateTempe** » Mon Dec 07, 2015 11:29 pm

Jefe wrote:
Beachcat97 wrote:Funny how it's "Go Zags" for the rest of the season.
UCLA is up there Saturday...
CalStateTempe wrote:Any way on gods green earth I can catch a reply?
Full game: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZGXDYcWIX9g" target="_blank

Thanks Jefe!

ESPN watch was giving me some problems with ffwd to the end, I really enjoyed streaming the last 10 on this.

Spaceman Spiff · Post by **Spaceman Spiff** » Tue Dec 08, 2015 9:51 am

legallykenny wrote:
Chicat wrote:Yeah, I just don't get the notion behind denigrating this win. That "two man team" had five guys on the court at all times. And it was their court (and loud as fuck at that). The Cats could have wilted. Could have run and hid. But instead they pulled out a gutty win a thousand+ miles from home.

I'm still beaming from that game. Guess I have to with so many others treating it like it meant nothing. I'll just go ahead and be a fan for you. You're welcome.
I don't like giving a program that has accomplished nothing any credit. Caring about beating a shit team like Gonzaga should be beneath us. Playing MSU last weekend would've meant much, much more to me.
When Gonzaga is inevitably 26-4 in March, just remember that they will have played one ranked team all year and lost to it. At home. Just like every year. Then they'll "shockingly" lose to a lower seed in the round of 32 or 16 in the tournament. Just like every year. So who cares about them?

I don't get hating on Gonzaga. They have legit talent and are very tough at home.

Consistently losing to a lower seed isn't a "s**t" team. It's Duke from 2005-10.

carolinacat · Post by **carolinacat** » Tue Dec 08, 2015 10:05 am

I don't think it's hating on Gonzaga but rather the general treatment they always seem to get from the national media. They're darlings to everyone and always overrated. Yes, they have talent. And yes, they've had some marginally decent teams over the last 15 years.

What irks me about their program is they get the benefit of the doubt from the media. Everyone is afraid to says what they really are: a program that year in and year out is competitive and has some nice pieces, but is cushioned by not having to play in a competitive conference for two straight months. They don't have to endure 18 games against any decent competition. Their conference schedule affords them maybe 2-3 truly competitive matches where they could lose if they don't play well. In a conference like the Pac 12, you get that may 2-3 times out of 18 games a year. Big difference.

Because of that, I resent Gonzaga getting over-seeded in the tournament seemingly every year. Two years ago I laughed at the notion of Seth Davis saying Arizona better watch out for Gonzaga in the second round. Really? That was a complete demolition of a team that was nowhere near Arizona's level of play. Sure, Gonzaga will steal a game here or there over established programs, which is fine. I'm not denying they have some talented players. But in reality, most Gonzaga teams would usually finish somewhere in the middle of the Pac if they competed in a real conference.

Arizona's win at the Kennel was great, making our record against them 6-1. That one loss was in Seattle when we were coming off losing DWill the previous season. That's it. Even when we're decidedly down like this season, we still have the mental toughness to go in a get a W.

Again, not hating on the Zags or anything with their program. I like Few. I like their fans and I like the nature in which they play. They're not dirty and not asses. I just think they get too much love sometimes. That being said, I hope they knock off UCLA this weekend to make our win there look even better. Go Zags!

Chicat · Post by **Chicat** » Tue Dec 08, 2015 10:26 am

Carolinacat, that was a very logical breakdown of why some might see Gonzaga as annually overrated. It's a nice contrast from reading a post and wondering if Mark Few once ran over the poster's dog.

I would say that Gonzaga doesn't seem to duck quality non-conference opponents and in my book that is reason for praise. I would also say their conference being fairly shitty is really not their fault. If they could join the PAC-12 for basketball only, I bet they would consider it. Third, I think them being overrated works in our favor every year we play them. If we are seen as having beaten a perceived power team on their court, that makes the perception of our relative strengths all the better and will help immensely come tournament seeding time.

Spaceman Spiff · Post by **Spaceman Spiff** » Tue Dec 08, 2015 10:35 am

Chicat wrote:Carolinacat, that was a very logical breakdown of why some might see Gonzaga as annually overrated. It's a nice contrast from reading a post and wondering if Mark Few once ran over the poster's dog.

I would say that Gonzaga doesn't seem to duck quality non-conference opponents and in my book that is reason for praise. I would also say their conference being fairly shitty is really not their fault. If they could join the PAC-12 for basketball only, I bet they would consider it. Third, I think them being overrated works in our favor every year we play them. If we are seen as having beaten a perceived power team on their court, that makes the perception of our relative strengths all the better and will help immensely come tournament seeding time.

Overrated is a better term for Gonzaga than s**tty. They can't play in a power conference because football, which isn't their fault.

Over the last 7 years, they've had 1 exit in the round of 64, 4 in the round of 32, 1 in the Sweet 16 and 1 in the Elite Eight. It isn't unfair to say that makes them overrated, but it's also the best midmajor tourney resume over that time period and one that most power conference teams would take in a heartbeat.

gumby · Post by **gumby** » Tue Dec 08, 2015 10:37 am

It is their fault. They should issue daily rebuttals to the media praise and go on the record as refusing to accept their ranking. Instead, they do nothing. In fact, they are bullies. The media are afraid -- yes, afraid! -- of telling the truth. Why? Because the Zag mafia will hunt them down!

They don't fool me. This is totally on them.

In fact, if Arizona were honest, it would put out a press release saying this victory should in no way help come seeding time. Just another win against a shit team. We should be ashamed if we try to leverage that for selfish purposes.

Anyway, nice Hansen column on the difficulty of what the Cats achieved.

http://tucson.com/sports/columnists/han ... c094e.html" target="_blank

In the history of Arizona basketball, 1,629 games, the Wildcats have won just 11 times against a higher-ranked team on the enemy’s turf.

Once in 1950.

Once in 1964.

Once in 1987.

Once in the ’90s.

Six times from 2000-09.

And Saturday at The Kennel.

Then again, it was just Gonzaga. So, shrug.

carolinacat · Post by **carolinacat** » Tue Dec 08, 2015 10:43 am

I'd argue that Butler, VCU & Wichita State have been better mid-major programs. And their conference competition is far tougher that Gonzaga's.

Gonzaga gets past the first round of the NCAA's easily because they're continuously over-rated and thus, overs-eeded (IMO). They're put in the same conversation with Arizona as having the best program in the West. It's not even close and quite frankly, insulting to programs like UCLA and Oregon and even SDSU

Look, I'm not hating on them at all. I just think they get too much positive press considering what they've accomplished: which is exactly one trip past the Sweet 16 in the last 16 years.

gumby · Post by **gumby** » Tue Dec 08, 2015 10:47 am

carolinacat wrote: I'd argue that Butler, VCU & Wichita State have been better mid-major programs. And their conference competition is far tougher that Gonzaga's.

Gonzaga gets past the first round of the NCAA's easily because they're continuously over-rated and thus, overs-eeded (IMO). They're put in the same conversation with Arizona as having the best program in the West. It's not even close and quite frankly, insulting to programs like UCLA and Oregon and even SDSU

Look, I'm not hating on them at all. I just think they get too much positive press considering what they've accomplished: which is exactly one trip past the Sweet 16 in the last 16 years.

That's a short time frame, if you think this. Zags have sustained this since 1999 (beating a 2 seed and a 3 seed). Nobody cared about those other mid-majors until recently.

Merkin · Post by **Merkin** » Tue Dec 08, 2015 10:49 am

gumby wrote:It is their fault. They should issue daily rebuttals to the media praise and go on the record as refusing to accept their ranking. Instead, they do nothing. In fact, they are bullies. The media are afraid -- yes, afraid! -- of telling the truth. Why? Because the Zag mafia will hunt them down!

They don't fool me. This is totally on them.

In fact, if Arizona were honest, it would put out a press release saying this victory should in no way help come seeding time. Just another win against a shit team. We should be ashamed if we try to leverage that for selfish purposes.

Anyway, nice Hansen column on the difficulty of what the Cats achieved.

http://tucson.com/sports/columnists/han ... n-college-" target="_blank
basketball/article_2d95368e-c268-578b-8ec1-db82244c094e.html

Then again, it was just Gonzaga. So, shrug.

You can tell Pops is my generation, but even I wouldn't use this analogy:

you’d have thought you were in the front row at a KISS concert.

In the history of Arizona basketball, 1,629 games, the Wildcats have won just 11 times against a higher-ranked team on the enemy’s turf.

Amazing stat, you think the football team would have a similar number. Of course if you add neutral courts (NCAA tourney) the UA has done fairly well.

gumby · Post by **gumby** » Tue Dec 08, 2015 10:54 am

Merkin wrote:
gumby wrote:It is their fault. They should issue daily rebuttals to the media praise and go on the record as refusing to accept their ranking. Instead, they do nothing. In fact, they are bullies. The media are afraid -- yes, afraid! -- of telling the truth. Why? Because the Zag mafia will hunt them down!

They don't fool me. This is totally on them.

In fact, if Arizona were honest, it would put out a press release saying this victory should in no way help come seeding time. Just another win against a shit team. We should be ashamed if we try to leverage that for selfish purposes.

Anyway, nice Hansen column on the difficulty of what the Cats achieved.

http://tucson.com/sports/columnists/han ... n-college-" target="_blank
basketball/article_2d95368e-c268-578b-8ec1-db82244c094e.html

Then again, it was just Gonzaga. So, shrug.
You can tell Pops is my generation, but even I wouldn't use this analogy:

you’d have thought you were in the front row at a KISS concert.

In the history of Arizona basketball, 1,629 games, the Wildcats have won just 11 times against a higher-ranked team on the enemy’s turf.

Amazing stat, you think the football team would have a similar number. Of course if you add neutral courts (NCAA tourney) the UA has done fairly well.

Never had the pleasure of a KISS concert, but it was freaking loud.

How hard is it to beat a ranked team on its court? Overall, Olson was 23-34.

Miller is now 3-2.

*shrug*

Where's my Final Four? Where's my elite recruiting class every year? Where's my pacifier?

carolinacat · Post by **carolinacat** » Tue Dec 08, 2015 11:00 am

gumby wrote:
carolinacat wrote: I'd argue that Butler, VCU & Wichita State have been better mid-major programs. And their conference competition is far tougher that Gonzaga's.

Gonzaga gets past the first round of the NCAA's easily because they're continuously over-rated and thus, overs-eeded (IMO). They're put in the same conversation with Arizona as having the best program in the West. It's not even close and quite frankly, insulting to programs like UCLA and Oregon and even SDSU

Look, I'm not hating on them at all. I just think they get too much positive press considering what they've accomplished: which is exactly one trip past the Sweet 16 in the last 16 years.
That's a short time frame, if you think this. Zags have sustained this since 1999 (beating a 2 seed and a 3 seed). Nobody cared about those other mid-majors until recently.

I know. But the fact is that Butler, VCU & Wichita State have all had multiple runs to either the Final 4 or Elite 8 in that short time frame. Gonzaga benefits from being a good program in a really crappy conference. Really crappy. They acquit themselves nicely during the OOC schedule, they dominate their conference and get a high seed in the tourney, guaranteeing an easy opponent in the first round of the NCAA tourney.

Last year's team was an exception. I thought that had all the pieces and were legit.

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