Bear Down Wildcats

I think some people have this idea that Sean Miller is literally kicking kids in the ass on their way out the door while they cry and gnash their teeth and beg for another chance screaming "please don't make me transfer!!!" All the while Sean is laughing maniacally, lighting cigars with hundred dollar bills and then lighting the kid's scholarship papers on fire with the same flame.

Longhorned wrote:Like Chicat, I'm lost on what you're saying, pc. How is this about exploiting student-athletes? I think they should be allowed to be paid above board, but that's a different issue than Doutrive leaving the program.

When more scholarships are offered than there are available student-athletes, who knows exactly what has led to the decision of an athlete to leave?

I think its an open question, since the honest details are seldom shared. I've seen no specific, reliable explanation of the details leading to this outcome. But, its clear that the extra scholarship was offered before the announcement of the available space was given.

IMNSHO, the turnover of players, regardless of the reasons (one-and-done, lack of PT, being "pushed" out, or whatever) makes the college game less appealing, and that trend is increasing, not declining....

pc in NM wrote:

Longhorned wrote:Like Chicat, I'm lost on what you're saying, pc. How is this about exploiting student-athletes? I think they should be allowed to be paid above board, but that's a different issue than Doutrive leaving the program.

When more scholarships are offered than there are available student-athletes, who knows exactly what has led to the decision of an athlete to leave?

I think its an open question, since the honest details are seldom shared. I've seen no specific, reliable explanation of the details leading to this outcome. But, its clear that the extra scholarship was offered before the announcement of the available space was given.

IMNSHO, the turnover of players, regardless of the reasons (one-and-done, lack of PT, being "pushed" out, or whatever) makes the college game less appealing, and that trend is increasing, not declining....

Offering more scholarships than spots available on the team has always been the case, and has always started with high school recruits. Like I've always said, an offer isn't an offer in the sense of an "offer" of an athletic scholarship. It's empty gesture, like the valentines collected on February 14 by a child in grade school who shows off how many are in his basket.

To be on the team, the student-athlete and the coaches have to be in conversations and come to an agreement. That's normal practice, and it should be assumed unless there's reason to believe otherwise. In the case of Doutrive, the extraordinary belief should be that Miller offered Doutrive's scholarship to another player, who accepted the offer and left a current player stranded.

So the consensus is that Miller pulled Doutrive's scholarship over Barcello's, even though DD is a much better player because Doutrive has off court team chemistry issues?

Merkin wrote:So the consensus is that Miller pulled Doutrive's scholarship over Barcello's, even though DD is a much better player because Doutrive has off court team chemistry issues?

That's not how I understand it. And it wouldn't make sense. What would make sense is that one of the two was on board, and the other wasn't. And therefore one had nothing to do with the other, since this wasn't about basketball, and chemistry issues don't really exist. Chemistry issues are like UFO's or black holes, and stuff like that. Woops, looks like I need to take it to the GD board.

Merkin wrote:So the consensus is that Miller pulled Doutrive's scholarship over Barcello's, even though DD is a much better player because Doutrive has off court team chemistry issues?

Not really, it seems more like Miller went after Baker aggressively due to those issues, and it became one of those "writing's on the wall" situation.

I will say this, I liked Doutrive's game, but if the off court rumors are true, he isn't good enough to put up with too much off the court stuff. Barcello doesn't seem to have any off the court drama.

ChooChooCat wrote:

Baker took his spot.

I fucking hate this. This kid is going to crush it elsewhere - massive chip on his shoulder and no Miller glass ceiling. Go get em DD.

Was RJ Hampton going to eligible? I think he'd be the 1st player to go overseas for any other reason.

SunnyAZ wrote:Was RJ Hampton going to eligible? I think he'd be the 1st player to go overseas for any other reason.

Jeremy Tyler skipped his senior year of high school to go overseas, so I think he beat Hampton unless he was already ineligible.

ChooChooCat wrote:

goslingswagg wrote:

ChooChooCat wrote:
If Doutrive was pushed out it would have nothing to do with his play.

grades?

Nope.

Choo, you don't need to say anymore on it if you don't want to. I just figured I'd quote this convo, I would imagine the transferring of DD still isn't about basketball or his grades. I might be off here, but maybe Miller's hand was more forced in this situation than it seems?

what about being a disruptive, whinny, cock sucker of a teammate?

does that clear it all up for you guys...im in no fucking mood today.

i dont give a fuck how good you are, no player is bigger or more important than the team.

97cats wrote:what about being a disruptive, whinny, cock sucker of a teammate?

does that clear it all up for you guys...im in no fucking mood today.

i dont give a fuck how good you are, no player is bigger or more important than the team.

Well that'll do it.

97cats wrote:what about being a disruptive, whinny, cock sucker of a teammate?

does that clear it all up for you guys...im in no fucking mood today.

i dont give a fuck how good you are, no player is bigger or more important than the team.

97cats wrote:what about being a disruptive, whinny, cock sucker of a teammate?

does that clear it all up for you guys...im in no fucking mood today.

i dont give a fuck how good you are, no player is bigger or more important than the team.

pc in NM wrote:Win or GTFO, eh???

Neh...

97cats wrote:what about being a disruptive, whinny, cock sucker of a teammate?

does that clear it all up for you guys...im in no fucking mood today.

i dont give a fuck how good you are, no player is bigger or more important than the team.

Lute would have handed the keys to a player like that. Didn't Steve Kerr just loll around playing Donkey Kong while yelling at Roz to peel his grapes and bring him another Tab?

I missed this from last fall:

DD's brother (who strangely legally changed his name in 2018 to Vante Hendrix) "left" the Utah Utes despite being positioned as their next starting shooting guard. He played well through four games before being unceremoniously bounced in the middle of the Wooden Classic.

It seems this family isn't geared to be a part of a program - or at least not a program run by a hard nosed head coach.

Longhorned wrote:
Lute would have handed the keys to a player like that. Didn't Steve Kerr just loll around playing Donkey Kong while yelling at Roz to peel his grapes and bring him another Tab?

You gonna order something, kid?

Ah, yeah. Give me - Give me a Tab.

Tab? I can't give you a tab unless you order something.

Right. Give me a Pepsi Free.

You want a Pepsi, pal, you're gonna pay for it.

YoDeFoe wrote:I missed this from last fall:

DD's brother (who strangely legally changed his name in 2018 to Vante Hendrix) "left" the Utah Utes despite being positioned as their next starting shooting guard. He played well through four games before being unceremoniously bounced in the middle of the Wooden Classic.

It seems this family isn't geared to be a part of a program - or at least not a program run by a hard nosed head coach.

Appeared to be mutual but who knows what the real story was.

84Cat wrote:R J Hampton to forgo college and play in New Zealand. Fuegs must be sad

L

^^ Classic, that made my day

StickItInTheyFace wrote:

84Cat wrote:R J Hampton to forgo college and play in New Zealand. Fuegs must be sad

L

New Zealand looked incredible in Lord of the Rings.

How old must one be to understand Tab and Pepsi Free jokes?

97cats wrote:what about being a disruptive, whinny, cock sucker of a teammate?

does that clear it all up for you guys...im in no fucking mood today.

i dont give a fuck how good you are, no player is bigger or more important than the team.

OMG inject "in no fucking mood" 97cats into my veins daily.

Will Bynum and Ruben Douglas. Justin Simon solely because the alternative was the wrong choice. That's literally the list of transfers I wished had hung around. If it was up to Douglas he would've never left.

Again, worth contrasting against the player replacing DD:

Jemarl Baker was a high school honor roll student, a dean's list student at UK, and an SEC Academic Honor Roll member. His father was a D1 basketball player. His sister is a D1 basketball player. Baker led his AAU circuit in three point shooting. He dropped 30 on Lonzo Ball in one game and held Lamelo to 17 in another. He played AAU with Ira Lee for West Coast Elite, the same program as Nico and Josh.

Here's how his dad describes him: “I really groomed him to be a point guard, but I also taught him that you can’t get on the court if you don’t play defense. If you can’t defend, you can’t get in the game. He knows you have to defend before you can shoot, pass or do anything,” Baker Sr. told me before his son ever got to Kentucky.

Here's UK's assistant coach: “When we’re recruiting backcourt guys, you always want someone that can create for themselves but first and foremost create for others because of what we’re going to have here,” Justus says. “The type of guys that we’re going to have and the type of players that have the type of dreams that they do, you need guys that can create for other people first but are also a threat, that have to be guarded.”

Here's how Reid Travis describes him: “He always seems to be in the right spot as far as getting loose balls and talking on defense,” said Travis. “He just does the little things right…never complains, always works hard so you respect a guy that comes to work every day…does what he has to do, and when he gets an opportunity, he’s able to take advantage of it. I’m really happy for him.”

We're upgrading, for sure.

YoDeFoe wrote:Again, worth contrasting against the player replacing DD:

Jemarl Baker was a high school honor roll student, a dean's list student at UK, and an SEC Academic Honor Roll member. His father was a D1 basketball player. His sister is a D1 basketball player. Baker led his AAU circuit in three point shooting. He dropped 30 on Lonzo Ball in one game and held Lamelo to 17 in another. He played AAU with Ira Lee for West Coast Elite, the same program as Nico and Josh.

Here's how his dad describes him: “I really groomed him to be a point guard, but I also taught him that you can’t get on the court if you don’t play defense. If you can’t defend, you can’t get in the game. He knows you have to defend before you can shoot, pass or do anything,” Baker Sr. told me before his son ever got to Kentucky.

Here's UK's assistant coach: “When we’re recruiting backcourt guys, you always want someone that can create for themselves but first and foremost create for others because of what we’re going to have here,” Justus says. “The type of guys that we’re going to have and the type of players that have the type of dreams that they do, you need guys that can create for other people first but are also a threat, that have to be guarded.”

Here's how Reid Travis describes him: “He always seems to be in the right spot as far as getting loose balls and talking on defense,” said Travis. “He just does the little things right…never complains, always works hard so you respect a guy that comes to work every day…does what he has to do, and when he gets an opportunity, he’s able to take advantage of it. I’m really happy for him.”

We're upgrading, for sure.

Awesome info, reading this gave me a feeling of comfort and excitement that I haven't yet felt regarding this situation.

Postmaster wrote:How old must one be to understand Tab and Pepsi Free jokes?

Not as old as you'd have to be to know what the Uncola is.

Great post YDF. Jermarl will be a perfect role player here imo. Exactly the kind of non-ball dominant, 3-and-D guard that feels like we haven't had in awhile but that is very valuable on a good team.

And thanks to 97 for helping us connect the dots here, I feel much more comfortable with DD leaving with the background info that we have now.

Longhorned wrote:

Postmaster wrote:How old must one be to understand Tab and Pepsi Free jokes?

Not as old as you'd have to be to know what the Uncola is.

And the glass you poured the uncola in was upside down.

Longhorned wrote:

Postmaster wrote:How old must one be to understand Tab and Pepsi Free jokes?

Not as old as you'd have to be to know what the Uncola is.

Or what a disaster New Coke was when it first came out, and now they are bringing it back?

YoDeFoe wrote:Again, worth contrasting against the player replacing DD:

Jemarl Baker was a high school honor roll student, a dean's list student at UK, and an SEC Academic Honor Roll member. His father was a D1 basketball player. His sister is a D1 basketball player. Baker led his AAU circuit in three point shooting. He dropped 30 on Lonzo Ball in one game and held Lamelo to 17 in another. He played AAU with Ira Lee for West Coast Elite, the same program as Nico and Josh.

Here's how his dad describes him: “I really groomed him to be a point guard, but I also taught him that you can’t get on the court if you don’t play defense. If you can’t defend, you can’t get in the game. He knows you have to defend before you can shoot, pass or do anything,” Baker Sr. told me before his son ever got to Kentucky.

Here's UK's assistant coach: “When we’re recruiting backcourt guys, you always want someone that can create for themselves but first and foremost create for others because of what we’re going to have here,” Justus says. “The type of guys that we’re going to have and the type of players that have the type of dreams that they do, you need guys that can create for other people first but are also a threat, that have to be guarded.”

Here's how Reid Travis describes him: “He always seems to be in the right spot as far as getting loose balls and talking on defense,” said Travis. “He just does the little things right…never complains, always works hard so you respect a guy that comes to work every day…does what he has to do, and when he gets an opportunity, he’s able to take advantage of it. I’m really happy for him.”

We're upgrading, for sure.

Nice summary. Hopefully the year off will continue his adjustment to college and injury recovery. Beyond that, a hard working defender who does little things is an asset. His shot was lauded out of HS, but wasn't great the single Kentucky year. If he can iron that out, I like the rest of the package.

Merkin wrote:

Longhorned wrote:

Postmaster wrote:How old must one be to understand Tab and Pepsi Free jokes?

Not as old as you'd have to be to know what the Uncola is.

Or what a disaster New Coke was when it first came out, and now they are bringing it back?

I don't drink soda but I saw an ad for Blueberry acai coke

So am I right to assume if we add Brown, we lose Smith as a grad transfer?

I’ll take that trade any day.

We would basically see more Armstrong this year and be able to upgrade our front court for the future.

IndianaZonaFan wrote:So am I right to assume if we add Brown, we lose Smith as a grad transfer?

I’ll take that trade any day.

We would basically see more Armstrong this year and be able to upgrade our front court for the future.

I honestly don't know what the plan is if we land Brown, but I'm less confident Smith is the one who goes in that scenario every day that passes.

ChooChooCat wrote:

IndianaZonaFan wrote:So am I right to assume if we add Brown, we lose Smith as a grad transfer?

I’ll take that trade any day.

We would basically see more Armstrong this year and be able to upgrade our front court for the future.

I honestly don't know what the plan is if we land Brown, but I'm less confident Smith is the one who goes in that scenario every day that passes.

There really is no clear candidate to leave...has me concerned about who the staff thinks may leave. Honestly maybe Gettings? Could he transfer still considering he just sat out this past year? Maybe he thinks there's less mins available for him than he believed there would be when committing here. Doesn't seem like Barcello will be forced out, so it's hard to come up with another name. That's kind of why I'm ok not landing Brown...

ChooChooCat wrote:

IndianaZonaFan wrote:So am I right to assume if we add Brown, we lose Smith as a grad transfer?

I’ll take that trade any day.

We would basically see more Armstrong this year and be able to upgrade our front court for the future.

I honestly don't know what the plan is if we land Brown, but I'm less confident Smith is the one who goes in that scenario every day that passes.

My concern is that a post player for 2020-21 would exit with a Brown commit. Doesn't make sense that a wing would inherently be forced out (especially not someone like Smith, who would have expired his eligibility by the time Brown is available). If it's Koloko... probably fine, though I appreciate that he's a 7'1" true center. If its Nnaji... I wouldn't make that trade. He's a very good player and probably most importantly: we need him for depth this season.

YoDeFoe wrote:

ChooChooCat wrote:

IndianaZonaFan wrote:So am I right to assume if we add Brown, we lose Smith as a grad transfer?

I’ll take that trade any day.

We would basically see more Armstrong this year and be able to upgrade our front court for the future.

I honestly don't know what the plan is if we land Brown, but I'm less confident Smith is the one who goes in that scenario every day that passes.

My concern is that a post player for 2020-21 would exit with a Brown commit. Doesn't make sense that a wing would inherently be forced out (especially not someone like Smith, who would have expired his eligibility by the time Brown is available). If it's Koloko... probably fine, though I appreciate that he's a 7'1" true center. If its Nnaji... I wouldn't make that trade. He's a very good player and probably most importantly: we need him for depth this season.

Hard to believe Zeke would be too concerned with Brown on the roster next year, assuming Zeke even is. I think he and Brown would fit together well. The better defender takes the toughest assignment each night.

Still tons of minutes in 20/21. Even with Zeke on the roster there are only front court players.. Lee, Zeke, Koloko and Brown. Zeke and Brown would get 25-30 minutes each and Lee 15-20 and Koloko the rest.

So Randolph isn't coming back? Aren't we one over if BRan comes back?

Then we have to get rid of two guys if Brown comes. Are we preparing our slander for when we make two more guys leave?

ChooChooCat wrote:

IndianaZonaFan wrote:So am I right to assume if we add Brown, we lose Smith as a grad transfer?

I’ll take that trade any day.

We would basically see more Armstrong this year and be able to upgrade our front court for the future.

I honestly don't know what the plan is if we land Brown, but I'm less confident Smith is the one who goes in that scenario every day that passes.

That is so crazy. As GSS said, can't come up with a name that makes any sense. Barcello is the only other as he is likely to get little to no playing time, but the word seems he is staying.

Unless there is some loop hole since Smith is graduating that he can walk-on on his own volition. I am sure other programs would have already done this, but what other answer is there?

YoDeFoe wrote:

ChooChooCat wrote:

IndianaZonaFan wrote:So am I right to assume if we add Brown, we lose Smith as a grad transfer?

I’ll take that trade any day.

We would basically see more Armstrong this year and be able to upgrade our front court for the future.

I honestly don't know what the plan is if we land Brown, but I'm less confident Smith is the one who goes in that scenario every day that passes.

My concern is that a post player for 2020-21 would exit with a Brown commit. Doesn't make sense that a wing would inherently be forced out (especially not someone like Smith, who would have expired his eligibility by the time Brown is available). If it's Koloko... probably fine, though I appreciate that he's a 7'1" true center. If its Nnaji... I wouldn't make that trade. He's a very good player and probably most importantly: we need him for depth this season.

If Brown lost us Koloko, Koloko would not be seeing himself in the light I see him. Lee and Nnaji will get time in a 3 man rotation with Brown. Koloko is the guy who will take 2-3 years to be ready.

My number one fear next season is that Dylan Smith is on the floor in critical moments. I can’t help but think he’ll have a Jamelle Horne moment and commit some crazy foul or turnover.

zonagrad wrote:My number one fear next season is that Dylan Smith is on the floor in critical moments. I can’t help but think he’ll have a Jamelle Horne moment and commit some crazy foul or turnover.

Got to think that Smith is, at best, 9th on the depth chart. Our toughest games should see no more than 8 guys get meaningful minutes, with six or seven carrying the bulk.

None of the incoming freshmen are going anywhere. They're locked in. If we land Brown room will he made via the current roster.

ChooChooCat wrote:None of the incoming freshmen are going anywhere. They're locked in. If we land Brown room will he made via the current roster.

Appreciate the clarity, Choo.

pc in NM wrote: But, its clear that the extra scholarship was offered before the announcement of the available space was given.

Do you think the people involved in this decision (both from the school and player's side) didn't know about this before the offer & announcement were given?

Merkin wrote:

Longhorned wrote:

Postmaster wrote:How old must one be to understand Tab and Pepsi Free jokes?

Not as old as you'd have to be to know what the Uncola is.

Or what a disaster New Coke was when it first came out, and now they are bringing it back?

Give me some salty dry potato chips



PS I was the person that liked New Coke.

The thing that bothers me about the roster fluctuation is the loss of development in Miller’s Pack Line.
It seems like guys really need a season or two before they get it.

Postmaster wrote:The thing that bothers me about the roster fluctuation is the loss of development in Miller’s Pack Line.
It seems like guys really need a season or two before they get it.

They gotta want to get it too, that's the major problem.

zonagrad wrote:My number one fear next season is that Dylan Smith is on the floor in critical moments. I can’t help but think he’ll have a Jamelle Horne moment and commit some crazy foul or turnover.

I'd put my money more on being completely unable to finish at the rim. Like turning a wide open layup into throwing it over the backboard.

Spaceman Spiff wrote:

zonagrad wrote:My number one fear next season is that Dylan Smith is on the floor in critical moments. I can’t help but think he’ll have a Jamelle Horne moment and commit some crazy foul or turnover.

I'd put my money more on being completely unable to finish at the rim. Like turning a wide open layup into throwing it over the backboard.