Bear Down Wildcats

TatetheGreat wrote:No problem, Bangkok. I'll keep it to other boards.

Well the bottom line is we better figure out how to build a wall on D (sorry, couldn't help it) pretty damn soon or this season will go down the tubes fast.

Filings show potentially critical error in Feds' college hoops corruption case

Pete Thamel,Yahoo Sports 14 hours ago

Lawyers for multiple defendants in the college basketball corruption case filed motions to “suppress communications intercepted” in the case, including wiretaps that yielded information central to the federal government’s case.

The motion details multiple potential procedural breaches that could taint important evidence. But the most glaring comes from a claim of “a failure to identify the authorizing justice official” in the paperwork to obtain a wiretap.

According to the filing, the government’s paperwork to authorize an initial wiretap on Munish Sood, one of the defendants, says: “the Application has been authorized by [FILL IN], Acting Deputy Assistant Attorney General.”

According to the filings, failing to fill in that section could result in a breach that could potentially make it invalid.

The filings go on to claim a “lack of probable cause to search and seize the defendants’ cell phones,” “overboard warrants” that fail to limit the scope of searches and an improper interrogation technique on Adidas executive Jim Gatto that led to the federal government obtaining the passcode for his phone.

The most potentially significant claim, however, is the lack of a name being filled in the paperwork on the Sood wiretap on April 7, 2017. Federal investigators were targeting Sood, a financier, according to the paperwork, to track communications with Christian Dawkins, a middleman who was connecting Sood and others with high-profile players. (Sood was arrested but has not been indicted in the case, as it’s widely believed he’s cooperating with the federal government.)

This blank space in the wiretap paperwork could be problematic for the federal government. The filing goes on to cite a case – United States vs. Scurry – where asterisks were used in place of the authorizing official. A D.C. Circuit Court ruled “a wiretap order is insufficient on its face where it fails to identify the Justice Department official who approved the underlying application.”

It’s unknown whether that ruling directly translates here, but the motion is clearly an effort to suppress key information.

https://www.yahoo.com/sports/filings-sh ... 01641.html" target="_blank

EastCoastCat wrote:Well the bottom line is we better figure out how to build a wall on D (sorry, couldn't help it) pretty damn soon or this season will go down the tubes fast.

As much as I'd like to see the defense improve I just don't see it happening this late in the season. I think the Cats will have some good good or decent defensive games combined with bad ones resulting in a roller coaster final stretch of games. And I'm not going to suggest whose fault it is because I don't know enough to make a cogent suggestion. The only thing discouraging for me was how we lost to UCLA from an urgency standpoint. Coming off a loss I thought we'd put in a good defensive effort against a rival opponent and I just didn't see that much to my surprise. Losing at home to our biggest conference rival who isn't ranked with first place in the conference at stake left me scratching my head. As a fan it's one of the most disappointing home losses I can remember just because I didn't feel like the players were fully invested in putting the effort into winning.

So if we had Book go around to random incoming freshmen student and give them money, could we use the Carolina defense that it wasn't an athletic thing but open to various students?

More problems for the FBI's case...someone forgot to fill in the ruling Judge/court info in the initial wiretap submittal...

Basically if the wiretap on Sood gets tossed everything after that is built on a false premise (even if it's true)...

Things are not looking good for the FBI this last week...

Article here

CatFanOneMil wrote:More problems for the FBI's case...someone forgot to fill in the ruling Judge/court info in the initial wiretap submittal...

Basically if the wiretap on Sood gets tossed everything after that is built on a false premise (even if it's true)...

Things are not looking good for the FBI this last week...

Article here

Don't think that will.matter though for the NCAA

PHXCATS wrote:

CatFanOneMil wrote:More problems for the FBI's case...someone forgot to fill in the ruling Judge/court info in the initial wiretap submittal...

Basically if the wiretap on Sood gets tossed everything after that is built on a false premise (even if it's true)...

Things are not looking good for the FBI this last week...

Article here

Don't think that will.matter though for the NCAA

The NCAA can go right ahead and stick their collective dicks in a blender and hit “purée”.

Chicat wrote:

PHXCATS wrote:

CatFanOneMil wrote:More problems for the FBI's case...someone forgot to fill in the ruling Judge/court info in the initial wiretap submittal...

Basically if the wiretap on Sood gets tossed everything after that is built on a false premise (even if it's true)...

Things are not looking good for the FBI this last week...

Article here

Don't think that will.matter though for the NCAA

The NCAA can go right ahead and stick their collective dicks in a blender and hit “purée”.

Yep, exactly right and the cats need tho be very aggressive in their defense. Its all BS unless they bust out a big can of info indicting a bunch of schools IMO

azcat49 wrote:

Chicat wrote:

PHXCATS wrote:

CatFanOneMil wrote:More problems for the FBI's case...someone forgot to fill in the ruling Judge/court info in the initial wiretap submittal...

Basically if the wiretap on Sood gets tossed everything after that is built on a false premise (even if it's true)...

Things are not looking good for the FBI this last week...

Article here

Don't think that will.matter though for the NCAA

The NCAA can go right ahead and stick their collective dicks in a blender and hit “purée”.

Yep, exactly right and the cats need tho be very aggressive in their defense. Its all BS unless they bust out a big can of info indicting a bunch of schools IMO

So what you guys are saying is it DOES matter...

Chicat wrote:

PHXCATS wrote:

CatFanOneMil wrote:More problems for the FBI's case...someone forgot to fill in the ruling Judge/court info in the initial wiretap submittal...

Basically if the wiretap on Sood gets tossed everything after that is built on a false premise (even if it's true)...

Things are not looking good for the FBI this last week...

Article here

Don't think that will.matter though for the NCAA

The NCAA can go right ahead and stick their collective dicks in a blender and hit “purée”.

The only dicks which will wind up in a blender are those that gpt caught with their pants down in front of an FBI camera

PhxCats is right, any legal/technical issues with the FBI case will have NO bearing on what the NCAA does. Our case is not going to be decided in a court of law..........it will decided by NCAA bureaucrats (and they are Judge, Jury, and Executioner). Lots of folks rationalizing in this thread, the Cats are highly unlikely to walk away from this unscathed.

If it’s inadmissible evidence in a court of law, Arizona still admitted Book’s wrongdoing when they fired him.

Masks the NCAA prove it. If the feds can't then screw them. They fired Book and if we self admit (which I don't think we have done) then we are subject to penalties but I wouldn't give that corrupt org anything.

azcat49 wrote:Masks the NCAA prove it. If the feds can't then screw them. They fired Book and if we self admit (which I don't think we have done) then we are subject to penalties but I wouldn't give that corrupt org anything.

Firing Book admitted something didn't it?

Yep but that shows we took action and maybe a year of reduced scholarships is it. Prove he gave money to a kid. The NCAA can't ask(subpoena) for sh#t

azcat49 wrote:Yep but that shows we took action and maybe a year of reduced scholarships is it. Prove he grave money to a kid. The NCAA can't ask(subpoena) for sh#t

Here we go again. You do understand that this case is not going to court??? Its going to be decided in some bureaucrats office at NCAA headquarters..............they do NOT need court level proof. The FBI transcripts/tapes will likely be all they require.

Prove what? That some guy on audio tape said he would take 5K and maybe funnel some money to a kid. The NCAA is BS. F Them

azcat49 wrote:Prove what? That some guy on audio tape said he would take 5K and maybe funnel some money to a kid. The NCAA is BS. F Them

"F the NCAA"??

If only it were that simple. Unfortunately, as far as the UA (and our fate) is concerned the NCAA is God.

Once again for newbies......they don't need court level Proof........they only need to be convinced that we have violated NCAA rules.
This won't go to any court. NCAA members pretty much give up their souls to be part of the NCAA and collect all of that tournament & TV money.

People talk about the NCAA like they are gods, the truth is in the last 10 years it has become a very timid bureaucracy because it is a HUGE committee, while the FBI scandal seemed to be a big deal the NCAA most likely would like this to go away in the easiest possible manner since it reveals how powerless they really are...they will impose the least possible penalty for their image credibility...

This case is a credibility issue, they do not want to get into a fight with someone like Miller who will obviously NOT roll over if they go to far because Miller will call a national media timeout with 1 second left in a big profile game just to make sure his defense is set wink/wink...

IF THE FBI CASE GOES AWAY...the NCAA will have to do it's own investigation, it took four years to do it on classes at UNC, you think this will move quickly?

They will probably default a LOT of their decision on the UA's own independent internal investigation, I expect the UA to fully cooperate so they are primed to take legal action if the NCAA overplays their hand...

Its a red tape multi-layered bureaucracy that INCLUDES a TON of University Presidents input...at the end of the day its about the money and the illusion that its about the athletes...thats why UNC got away with their shit...

I doubt very seriously there is a whole lot gonna happen ti UA for a while EXCEPT taking a HUGE hit in recruiting...that might be where the penalties come in anyway.

Perfect analysis. UNC did much worse. Corrupting at the real level the ncaa should be concerned with, ACADEMICS. They rolled over in this. We need to stay strong and tell the NCAA to prove their point. They may hit us but we need to appeal if necessary

azcat49 wrote:Perfect analysis. UNC did much worse. Corrupting at the real level the ncaa should be concerned with, ACADEMICS. They rolled over in this. We need to stay strong and tell the NCAA to prove their point. They may hit us but we need to appeal if necessary

I'm waiting for an institution to sue the NCAA for defamation when they penalize a program for unsubstantiated accusations.

If Jahvon Quinerly is officially ruled ineligible, doesn't the NCAA have to penalize us?

They do whatever they want with no real proof, the very definition of corrupt

TatetheGreat wrote:If Jahvon Quinerly is officially ruled ineligible, doesn't the NCAA have to penalize us?

Not if he didn't play for us and we can show it was not lack of control and as soon as we found out, we fired the coach.

Otherwise, the NCAA is setting a dangerous precedent that states: "If a school learns they have an assistant that is engaging in a side business not related to the eligibility of students to pay a recruit, and the school learns of it and terminates the coach and the recruiting of the player, we will still punish you, so...Hide it as well as you can."

That would be insane. Quinerly never played here. We found out (doesn't matter how) a human being was acting out of concert with the program (just point to him going to Adidas at a Nike school to show how rogue that is). No one can control human activity...that isn't what institutional control is about. Institutional control is about acting quickly to show...CONTROL. When Miller fired Book and told Jahvon "no thanks...even though we don't have proof, you are tainted," that is Institutional Control. No eligibility compromised. Dude didn't even practice with us.

The NCAA cannot expect human subservience in the coaching ranks. Freewill exists. It's what you do when you learn of it that matters. And CSM reacted quickly, cooperated, and severed ties with a recruit that was only linked by hearsay. If the NCAA punishes that, no one will ever do anything to mitigate...it'll be "hide everything all the time".

TatetheGreat wrote:If Jahvon Quinerly is officially ruled ineligible, doesn't the NCAA have to penalize us?

Furthermore if Quinerly is ruled eligible how can the NCAA penalize us?

If anything comes of this, it should be tied up in court for years IMO.

Olsondogg wrote:If anything comes of this, it should be tied up in court for years IMO.

And that won't hurt us like some think. All we need to do is convince potential recruits that there is no real likelihood of sanctions during their time here. UNC recruited just fine under the shadow of a massive (or so we thought) investigation and certain (again, we thought) stiff penalties. It hurt them so much, they went to a championship game and won a title in back to back years.

The trick is showing there is nothing, and not likely to be anything. You cannot prove a negative. The NCAA will not say "We are investigating Arizona starting....NOW." Lots of programs have suspicions and recruit just fine.

With what we know, we should (SHOULD) be able to start engaging again. Look, we got rid of the coach, there may not have even been a payment, there is no link to the program, we exerted control immediately, the chance of sanctions that affect TV or postseason play are not within the reasonableness of what we know and what has been done in the past...

That should be sufficient. Kids/Parents don't care if Miller stayed too loyal to a guy loved by the kids who later proved to be turncoat. That can't be used by another program against us. The NCAA lowering the hammer is the only thing that could be used. And we played everyone, so it appears we are not worried about roster eligibility, Quinerly never came here, so we didn't play that maybe/maybe not ineligible player, and we fired the coach taking bribes against federal law who may not even be convicted.

It seems like, at least by perception (which is recruiting reality), we should be able to re-engage soon.

Quinnerly committing on Wednesday.

CatHoops wrote:Quinnerly committing on Wednesday.

Still hits like a punch to the gut.

FORTUNATELY we're seeing Brandon Williams look like a champ out there - big, strong, forceful.

every little thing... is gonna be alright...

CatHoops wrote:Quinnerly committing on Wednesday.

Where is he gonna land? Any guesses?

Beachcat97 wrote:

CatHoops wrote:Quinnerly committing on Wednesday.

Where is he gonna land? Any guesses?

Nova or Oklahoma. Thinking Nova is the home favorite.

azcat49 wrote:Just something I heard yesterday. Miller and his coaches will only have 1 session of their summer camp and the reason that was said was they didn't know if they would be here. That was depressing to hear

This is NOT to call out azcat49, but I just got the e-mail to register for the Sean Miller Basketball Camp and it's business as usual -- two one-week sessions starting in mid-June. What he heard earlier could well have been true at the time and maybe things changed recently. Either way, better news than hearing it's been outright cancelled or abbreviated though it doesn't necessarily portend anything, either.

FWIW.

No issue Pops, good to hear. I see the guy often so I can ask about the change but hopefully this is all good and we get back to some normalcy sooner rather than later

YoDeFoe wrote:

Beachcat97 wrote:

CatHoops wrote:Quinnerly committing on Wednesday.

Where is he gonna land? Any guesses?

Nova or Oklahoma. Thinking Nova is the home favorite.

It's Nova.

ChooChooCat wrote:

YoDeFoe wrote:

Beachcat97 wrote:

CatHoops wrote:Quinnerly committing on Wednesday.

Where is he gonna land? Any guesses?

Nova or Oklahoma. Thinking Nova is the home favorite.

It's Nova.

Once a Wildcat, always a Wildcat.

Olsondogg wrote:
Once a Wildcat, always a Wildcat.

I'm just gonna stop clicking on this thread.

If he's cleared, he can play anywhere but AZ? If he's not cleared, he can't play anywhere? Confused...

Jefe wrote:If he's cleared, he can play anywhere but AZ? If he's not cleared, he can't play anywhere? Confused...

Quinerly can go anywhere he wants, including Arizona. But the optics are and will always be bad. Same as EJ Montgomery & Auburn, Anfernee Simmons & Louisville etc etc. It's just best for both parties to go their separate ways at this point.

Anyway Quinerly is going to Villanova.

NYCat wrote:

Jefe wrote:If he's cleared, he can play anywhere but AZ? If he's not cleared, he can't play anywhere? Confused...

Quinerly can go anywhere he wants, including Arizona. But the optics are and will always be bad. Same as EJ Montgomery & Auburn, Anfernee Simmons & Louisville etc etc. It's just best for both parties to go their separate ways at this point.

Anyway Quinerly is going to Villanova.

The optics would have been ok if Quinerly had announced he picked us without knowing about any $ and wanted to honor that. When he decomitted, it started to look bad and the die were cast.

NYCat wrote:

"Federal prosecutors have motioned to dismiss....."

Wonder if there been a ruling, NY?

EOCT wrote:

NYCat wrote:

"Federal prosecutors have motioned to dismiss....."

Wonder if there been a ruling, NY?

The prosecutors are the ones bringing the motion to dismiss it is basically saying "nevermind we don't want to proceed"...there is no one else to take up the charges... the linked article says it was the prosecutors NOT the defendant making the motion to dismiss...they dropped the charges.

There is no case now because the prosecution is not pursuing it.

As far as I know ALL of the FBI's cases in the basketball scandall are in the New York grand jury

NYCat wrote:

Is it possible he rolled and turned state's evidence? I think normally that would be a plea agreement but IANAL.

YoDeFoe wrote:

NYCat wrote:

Is it possible he rolled and turned state's evidence? I think normally that would be a plea agreement but IANAL.

You don't normally dismiss the charges if you "roll", dismissing the charges means the government has no leverage...a plea agreement is a barter situation that includes charges of some kind, when they are dismissed they no longer have any legal force.

It's basically the cop tearing up your ticket...

Just the beginning of what's gonna happen. Just a shame they had to make it a circus with the press conference and all

Arizona/Miller should sue the feds for defamation.

Man why can’t we have nice things.

Does this take the pressure off Miller or does he still have to worry about the NCAA being their regular bitchy self?

CatFanOneMil wrote:

YoDeFoe wrote:Is it possible he rolled and turned state's evidence? I think normally that would be a plea agreement but IANAL.

You don't normally dismiss the charges if you "roll", dismissing the charges means the government has no leverage...a plea agreement is a barter situation that includes charges of some kind, when they are dismissed they no longer have any legal force.

It's basically the cop tearing up your ticket...

Well then, good news.

CalStateTempe wrote:Man why can’t we have nice things.

Does this take the pressure off Miller or does he still have to worry about the NCAA being their regular bitchy self?

NCAA violations aren't federal crimes. Still NCAA violations, of course that's if the FBI gives them everything they have.

With an agent misappropriating funds that just drags the case even slower and hangs the investigation out there even further. That's not good imo.