Bear Down Wildcats

Spaceman Spiff wrote: ↑Fri May 20, 2022 12:12 pm

RondaeShimmy wrote: ↑Fri May 20, 2022 11:48 am Way too many bigs

I don't know why people want the wazzu kid at all, fine with the 3 we have and 1 kid (Anderson) in the bullpen

Just the way I see it but we are too slow and not athletic enough at the wings and backcourt (assuming we land Ramsey and Terry comes back) yet again

When you play two traditional post bigs in college who can't go out and play on the perimeter with smaller college bigs defensively or space out the floor offensively, it's a recipe for repeated disaster.

Landing Ramey would be an absolute best case final lineup, IMO.

Bigs, Ballo, Veesaar and Tubelis. Anderson available in emergencies.

Wings, Dalen, Larsson and Bal.

Guards, Kerr and Ramey. If injury/suspension occurs on the perimeter, you slide from a 5 man rotation into a 4 man rotation. Borocavinin is available to maintain an emergency 5 man depth chart.

This is all I ever wanted. Give me Henri and a good two way combo guard and let's call it a day.

YoDeFoe wrote: ↑Fri May 20, 2022 12:13 pm

Spaceman Spiff wrote: ↑Fri May 20, 2022 12:12 pm

RondaeShimmy wrote: ↑Fri May 20, 2022 11:48 am Way too many bigs

I don't know why people want the wazzu kid at all, fine with the 3 we have and 1 kid (Anderson) in the bullpen

Just the way I see it but we are too slow and not athletic enough at the wings and backcourt (assuming we land Ramsey and Terry comes back) yet again

When you play two traditional post bigs in college who can't go out and play on the perimeter with smaller college bigs defensively or space out the floor offensively, it's a recipe for repeated disaster.

Landing Ramey would be an absolute best case final lineup, IMO.

Bigs, Ballo, Veesaar and Tubelis. Anderson available in emergencies.

Wings, Dalen, Larsson and Bal.

Guards, Kerr and Ramey. If injury/suspension occurs on the perimeter, you slide from a 5 man rotation into a 4 man rotation. Borocavinin is available to maintain an emergency 5 man depth chart.

This is all I ever wanted. Give me Henri and a good two way combo guard and let's call it a day.

I like it better than trying to drop in Efe or Miller by far because you're not stuck trying to sell a talented guy on minimal minutes and worrying about locker room issues or dissatisfaction.

I see that as 8 strong players with 2 additional freshmen to learn and jump in if needed. IMO, pushing for more than that usually leads to things like Kobi Simmons sulking after losing minutes to Trier.

Every dude in that top 8 is someone I'd give 20 mpg to with zero hesitation with the possible exception of needing to see Bal develop physically a little before I lay money. But I fully expect Bal will get there and other than that you have 7 rocks and can easily fill out 200 minutes.

My very untrained eye tells me Tube has some issues to work on and development needed. Not a given he'll get there.

RondaeShimmy wrote: ↑Fri May 20, 2022 11:48 am Way too many bigs

I don't know why people want the wazzu kid at all, fine with the 3 we have and 1 kid (Anderson) in the bullpen

Just the way I see it but we are too slow and not athletic enough at the wings and backcourt (assuming we land Ramsey and Terry comes back) yet again

When you play two traditional post bigs in college who can't go out and play on the perimeter with smaller college bigs defensively or space out the floor offensively, it's a recipe for repeated disaster.

To be fair Efe can hang on the perimeter defensively, but your point is made on lack of perimeter offense.

Not sure I agree with the too many bigs situation. If we want to win a title we need depth and versatility at all positions, especially at the lead guard spot. Considering all the bad luck we've had I think putting together a roster like that is just hedging for the inevitable.

RawleArenas wrote: ↑Fri May 20, 2022 1:10 pm Not sure I agree with the too many bigs situation. If we want to win a title we need depth and versatility at all positions, especially at the lead guard spot. Considering all the bad luck we've had I think putting together a roster like that is just hedging for the inevitable.

Eh, you can't play 12 deep and sooner or later, players are gonna be unhappy sacrificing pro aspirations to sit and hope someone ahead of them gets injured.

If we put too many eggs in that basket, I worry it does more harm than good. I can basically name one time this century a rotation of more than 8 guys was a championship contender and that team lost in the Final Four (2015 Kentucky).

Point taken. I don't think 12 is good, but 9ish is allright. I think you can have high impact players who are comfortable with 20 a game. Even if they could start somewhere else. That Kentucky team was exactly what I was thinking of.

Bal and Boro are going to split ~30min at the back end of an eight man rotation with today’s roster, right? Any additional player pushes one out of the rotation and two (like a combo and Miller or Efe) pushes them both to permanent bench roles this year.

I’m struggling with the tension between “these guys have incredible ceilings, I want to see them play” and “you can’t trust growth, you can’t bank on health, you can’t expect ceilings - the program is better the more talent we bring in.”

If we didn’t bring in another player: would y’all be good allocating 17min/g to Bal and 13min/g to Boro? That’d be more like 15 & 5min in a big game.

The Zags had two McD’s AAs in those roles last season. Maybe I’m setting our bar too low.

YoDeFoe wrote: ↑Sun May 22, 2022 12:07 am Bal and Boro are going to split ~30min at the back end of an eight man rotation with today’s roster, right? Any additional player pushes one out of the rotation and two (like a combo and Miller or Efe) pushes them both to permanent bench roles this year.

I’m struggling with the tension between “these guys have incredible ceilings, I want to see them play” and “you can’t trust growth, you can’t bank on health, you can’t expect ceilings - the program is better the more talent we bring in.”

If we didn’t bring in another player: would y’all be good allocating 17min/g to Bal and 13min/g to Boro? That’d be more like 15 & 5min in a big game.

The Zags had two McD’s AAs in those roles last season. Maybe I’m setting our bar too low.

Basically how I'm viewing it:

PG : Kerr/Transfer Combo
SG: Pelle/Bal/Transfer Combo
SF: Dalen/Bal/Boro
PF: Tubelis/Veesaar/One of the SFs in a small lineup
C: Ballo/Veesaar

If we land Efe I think he starts at the 5 and can slide over to the 4, which pushes Boro into Freshman year Bal playing time. So essentially a 9 man rotation.

ChooChooCat wrote: ↑Sun May 22, 2022 5:08 am

YoDeFoe wrote: ↑Sun May 22, 2022 12:07 am Bal and Boro are going to split ~30min at the back end of an eight man rotation with today’s roster, right? Any additional player pushes one out of the rotation and two (like a combo and Miller or Efe) pushes them both to permanent bench roles this year.

I’m struggling with the tension between “these guys have incredible ceilings, I want to see them play” and “you can’t trust growth, you can’t bank on health, you can’t expect ceilings - the program is better the more talent we bring in.”

If we didn’t bring in another player: would y’all be good allocating 17min/g to Bal and 13min/g to Boro? That’d be more like 15 & 5min in a big game.

The Zags had two McD’s AAs in those roles last season. Maybe I’m setting our bar too low.

Basically how I'm viewing it:

PG : Kerr/Transfer Combo
SG: Pelle/Bal/Transfer Combo
SF: Dalen/Bal/Boro
PF: Tubelis/Veesaar/One of the SFs in a small lineup
C: Ballo/Veesaar

If we land Efe I think he starts at the 5 and can slide over to the 4, which pushes Boro into Freshman year Bal playing time. So essentially a 9 man rotation.

I think a 9 man rotation is a fantasy unless we're talking about dudes who get PT due to garbage minutes. In a meaningful game, Lloyd is likely going to play our best guys as close to 40min as possible, with the 7th and 8th man collecting a total of 10-20min.

In a tough game: Kerr, Dalen, Pelle, Zu getting ~35min/g, Ballo and Veesaar splitting ~45min, and a combo guard (Bal or a transfer) taking the remaining 15-20min. Maybe an 8th man gets 5min due to foul trouble or the coaches trying a different look.

That's just how it shakes out. Players emerge as better than their competitors on the roster and they get the PT.

If we got Efe, I don't know what we would change about the above beyond... reducing Zu's minutes? Sending Ballo to the bench such that he only plays 10 min as the second big off the bench? Is that what we're hoping to do - reduce the impact of the returning 1st all conf player and arguable sixth man winner?

I’m of the opinion that a 9 man rotation works much better if we added a combo forward and not a 4/5, but what do I know?

If I was a betting man I’d bet on Efe ending up at Maryland and Miller ending up in the G League after getting drafted late 1st/early 2nd. If Arizona does miss on both then I imagine a late transfer addition or maybe even another international are added.

[/quote]
If we got Efe, I don't know what we would change the above beyond... reducing Zu's minutes? Sending Ballo to the bench such that he only plays 10 min as the second big off the bench? Is that what we're hoping to do - reduce the impact of the returning 1st all conf player and arguable sixth man winner?
[/quote]

Efe’s only use to playing about 20 minutes per game because of a knee injury.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.cougce ... highlights

I'm just saying

On the flip side - we sure could have used a back-up to Zu back in March.

YoDeFoe wrote: ↑Sun May 22, 2022 4:17 pm On the flip side - we sure could have used a back-up to Zu back in March.

We had one, but he did something really stupid. With that said if he didn’t do that stupid thing we would’ve had a 9 man rotation all year.

Are we ever going to find out the stupid thing?

Also, I wonder if Zu ever fully recovered from the ankle injury

Postmaster wrote: ↑Sun May 22, 2022 10:47 pm Are we ever going to find out the stupid thing?

Also, I wonder if Zu ever fully recovered from the ankle injury

Officially, no. If you wanna grab brews one day I'd tell ya though. It's nothing earth shattering, I promise.

To be broad, probably just being a bad teammate?

Let it be. Does not matter anymore.

EastCoastCat wrote: ↑Mon May 23, 2022 9:25 am Let it be. Does not matter anymore.

Beatles + Metallica.

dmjcat wrote: ↑Mon May 23, 2022 2:56 pm

I see the fit much easier than with Efe. Positional flexibility to the wing and/or 4 helps a lot.

Spaceman Spiff wrote: ↑Mon May 23, 2022 3:21 pm

dmjcat wrote: ↑Mon May 23, 2022 2:56 pm

I see the fit much easier than with Efe. Positional flexibility to the wing and/or 4 helps a lot.

He’s going to want to start and if Terry comes back that ain’t happening.

ChooChooCat wrote: ↑Mon May 23, 2022 3:33 pm

Spaceman Spiff wrote: ↑Mon May 23, 2022 3:21 pm

dmjcat wrote: ↑Mon May 23, 2022 2:56 pm

I see the fit much easier than with Efe. Positional flexibility to the wing and/or 4 helps a lot.

He’s going to want to start and if Terry comes back that ain’t happening.

don't like him as much as a 3 - feels like he can play there some minutes there in a big lineup, but he's a more natural 4

goslingswagg wrote: ↑Mon May 23, 2022 4:01 pm

ChooChooCat wrote: ↑Mon May 23, 2022 3:33 pm

Spaceman Spiff wrote: ↑Mon May 23, 2022 3:21 pm

dmjcat wrote: ↑Mon May 23, 2022 2:56 pm

I see the fit much easier than with Efe. Positional flexibility to the wing and/or 4 helps a lot.

He’s going to want to start and if Terry comes back that ain’t happening.

don't like him as much as a 3 - feels like he can play there some minutes there in a big lineup, but he's a more natural 4

He can probably defend a 3, but yeah he doesn’t have a wing’s offense outside of a midrange jumper.

ChooChooCat wrote: ↑Mon May 23, 2022 3:33 pm

Spaceman Spiff wrote: ↑Mon May 23, 2022 3:21 pm

dmjcat wrote: ↑Mon May 23, 2022 2:56 pm

I see the fit much easier than with Efe. Positional flexibility to the wing and/or 4 helps a lot.

He’s going to want to start and if Terry comes back that ain’t happening.

I've said it a ton, but I wonder how many of our recruits will.

ChooChooCat wrote: ↑Mon May 23, 2022 4:42 pm

goslingswagg wrote: ↑Mon May 23, 2022 4:01 pm

ChooChooCat wrote: ↑Mon May 23, 2022 3:33 pm

Spaceman Spiff wrote: ↑Mon May 23, 2022 3:21 pm

dmjcat wrote: ↑Mon May 23, 2022 2:56 pm

I see the fit much easier than with Efe. Positional flexibility to the wing and/or 4 helps a lot.

He’s going to want to start and if Terry comes back that ain’t happening.

don't like him as much as a 3 - feels like he can play there some minutes there in a big lineup, but he's a more natural 4

He can probably defend a 3, but yeah he doesn’t have a wing’s offense outside of a midrange jumper.

What is this midrange jumper you speak of?

Spaceman Spiff wrote: ↑Mon May 23, 2022 9:35 am

EastCoastCat wrote: ↑Mon May 23, 2022 9:25 am Let it be. Does not matter anymore.

Beatles + Metallica.

I think it’s “nothing else matters”.

Of course, maybe we should only make Who references, based on the coach.

Postmaster wrote: ↑Tue May 24, 2022 9:26 pm

ChooChooCat wrote: ↑Mon May 23, 2022 4:42 pm

goslingswagg wrote: ↑Mon May 23, 2022 4:01 pm

ChooChooCat wrote: ↑Mon May 23, 2022 3:33 pm

Spaceman Spiff wrote: ↑Mon May 23, 2022 3:21 pm

I see the fit much easier than with Efe. Positional flexibility to the wing and/or 4 helps a lot.

He’s going to want to start and if Terry comes back that ain’t happening.

don't like him as much as a 3 - feels like he can play there some minutes there in a big lineup, but he's a more natural 4

He can probably defend a 3, but yeah he doesn’t have a wing’s offense outside of a midrange jumper.

What is this midrange jumper you speak of?

It's also known as the worst shot in modern basketball and the reason no one appreciates Demar DeRozan.

Spaceman Spiff wrote: ↑Wed May 25, 2022 8:21 am

Postmaster wrote: ↑Tue May 24, 2022 9:26 pm

ChooChooCat wrote: ↑Mon May 23, 2022 4:42 pm

goslingswagg wrote: ↑Mon May 23, 2022 4:01 pm

ChooChooCat wrote: ↑Mon May 23, 2022 3:33 pm

He’s going to want to start and if Terry comes back that ain’t happening.

don't like him as much as a 3 - feels like he can play there some minutes there in a big lineup, but he's a more natural 4

He can probably defend a 3, but yeah he doesn’t have a wing’s offense outside of a midrange jumper.

What is this midrange jumper you speak of?

It's also known as the worst shot in modern basketball and the reason no one appreciates Demar DeRozan.

I had a killer mid-range jumper (back in the day)!!!

pc in NM wrote: ↑Wed May 25, 2022 9:04 am

Spaceman Spiff wrote: ↑Wed May 25, 2022 8:21 am

Postmaster wrote: ↑Tue May 24, 2022 9:26 pm

ChooChooCat wrote: ↑Mon May 23, 2022 4:42 pm

goslingswagg wrote: ↑Mon May 23, 2022 4:01 pm

don't like him as much as a 3 - feels like he can play there some minutes there in a big lineup, but he's a more natural 4

He can probably defend a 3, but yeah he doesn’t have a wing’s offense outside of a midrange jumper.

What is this midrange jumper you speak of?

It's also known as the worst shot in modern basketball and the reason no one appreciates Demar DeRozan.

I had a killer mid-range jumper (back in the day)!!!

He's talking about after the 3 point line went into effect.

UAEebs86 wrote: ↑Wed May 25, 2022 9:15 am

pc in NM wrote: ↑Wed May 25, 2022 9:04 am

Spaceman Spiff wrote: ↑Wed May 25, 2022 8:21 am

Postmaster wrote: ↑Tue May 24, 2022 9:26 pm

ChooChooCat wrote: ↑Mon May 23, 2022 4:42 pm

He can probably defend a 3, but yeah he doesn’t have a wing’s offense outside of a midrange jumper.

What is this midrange jumper you speak of?

It's also known as the worst shot in modern basketball and the reason no one appreciates Demar DeRozan.

I had a killer mid-range jumper (back in the day)!!!

He's talking about after the 3 point line went into effect.

I know. Fortunately, I was forced to quit BB in ‘86 due to a hernieted disk…

… I was more or less obsolete by then anyway.

pc in NM wrote: ↑Wed May 25, 2022 9:04 am

Spaceman Spiff wrote: ↑Wed May 25, 2022 8:21 am

Postmaster wrote: ↑Tue May 24, 2022 9:26 pm

ChooChooCat wrote: ↑Mon May 23, 2022 4:42 pm

goslingswagg wrote: ↑Mon May 23, 2022 4:01 pm

don't like him as much as a 3 - feels like he can play there some minutes there in a big lineup, but he's a more natural 4

He can probably defend a 3, but yeah he doesn’t have a wing’s offense outside of a midrange jumper.

What is this midrange jumper you speak of?

It's also known as the worst shot in modern basketball and the reason no one appreciates Demar DeRozan.

I had a killer mid-range jumper (back in the day)!!!

Did you use the glass? It only counts if you used the glass.

Now that’s Old School!

YoDeFoe wrote: ↑Fri May 20, 2022 12:11 pm

RondaeShimmy wrote: ↑Fri May 20, 2022 11:48 am Way too many bigs

I don't know why people want the wazzu kid at all, fine with the 3 we have and 1 kid (Anderson) in the bullpen

Just the way I see it but we are too slow and not athletic enough at the wings and backcourt (assuming we land Ramsey and Terry comes back) yet again

When you play two traditional post bigs in college who can't go out and play on the perimeter with smaller college bigs defensively or space out the floor offensively, it's a recipe for repeated disaster.

HV can play on the perimeter (on both ends), Tubelis hopefully gets more perimeter skills on both ends (he showed some willingness to shoot from distance last season), and Efe can play on the perimeter on both ends (though I don't like him taking those shots unless he improves his feel from distance).

In theory.

I've just seen this way too many times already and recently. An opposing team of like 3 or 4 guys 6'3 and under and maybe a 6'5 guy and a 6'8-6'9 "big" will dribble past them and strip them the ball consistently while also preventing our guards from even getting the ball to the bigs

Kinda disappointed Lloyd picked up where Miller left off in being obsessed with SIZE. I initially thought he played the way he did because he inherited a couple good bigs and you're forced to play them together but this seems like it's continuing.

We're going to be too big and slow again when it matters most.

Nice profile in the Toronto Star on Leonard Miller


How Scarborough’s Leonard Miller became this year’s most intriguing NBA draft prospect
Miller has to decide whether to stay in the NBA draft, withdraw his name before Wednesday and maintain his college eligibility or spend next year earning a salary with the G League Ignite before entering the draft again.
https://www.thestar.com/news/gta/2022/0 ... spect.html

Miller making announcement tomorrow (5/31) @ 4EST

Are we to assume that we will know DT's decision by then or does it matter?

IndianaZonaFan wrote: ↑Mon May 30, 2022 5:19 pm Miller making announcement tomorrow (5/31) @ 4EST

84Cat wrote: ↑Mon May 30, 2022 5:22 pm Are we to assume that we will know DT's decision by then or does it matter?

Likely won’t know DT’s decision until the following day.

ChooChooCat wrote: ↑Mon May 30, 2022 7:02 pm

84Cat wrote: ↑Mon May 30, 2022 5:22 pm Are we to assume that we will know DT's decision by then or does it matter?

Likely won’t know DT’s decision until the following day.

What's your gut on Miller, Choo?

billk78 wrote: ↑Tue May 31, 2022 7:55 am

ChooChooCat wrote: ↑Mon May 30, 2022 7:02 pm

84Cat wrote: ↑Mon May 30, 2022 5:22 pm Are we to assume that we will know DT's decision by then or does it matter?

Likely won’t know DT’s decision until the following day.

What's your gut on Miller, Choo?

G League

ChooChooCat wrote: ↑Tue May 31, 2022 8:03 am

billk78 wrote: ↑Tue May 31, 2022 7:55 am

ChooChooCat wrote: ↑Mon May 30, 2022 7:02 pm

84Cat wrote: ↑Mon May 30, 2022 5:22 pm Are we to assume that we will know DT's decision by then or does it matter?

Likely won’t know DT’s decision until the following day.

What's your gut on Miller, Choo?

G League

As expected

He's this year's Ndudi Ebi.

Another none-and-done!!

I'm skeptical of the missed value, in any case....

ChooChooCat wrote: ↑Tue May 31, 2022 8:03 am

billk78 wrote: ↑Tue May 31, 2022 7:55 am

ChooChooCat wrote: ↑Mon May 30, 2022 7:02 pm

84Cat wrote: ↑Mon May 30, 2022 5:22 pm Are we to assume that we will know DT's decision by then or does it matter?

Likely won’t know DT’s decision until the following day.

What's your gut on Miller, Choo?

G League

Nice call, as usual

Hmmm....