Bear Down Wildcats

Teams that play with that lack of interest and preparedness are hard to route for. Came out flat, stayed flat, lost an absolutely killer game to any hope of a protected seed and is now looking at Utah as the favorite to win the league. Just awful.

Idk who to put the blame on. Enough of it to go around.

I cannot understand why this team plays so methodical. When you have the supposed talent and athletes? We should really be trying to get as many possessions as possible.

I'm at a lost.

I think TJ played with heart and desire

They're playing Arizona

cats101 wrote:They're playing Arizona

I'm not sure what you're saying here but if it's that OSU played "up" because Its arizona, then I don't give a shit. That can't always be the excuse, at some point you have to come out prepared and ready to go. Too often we've seen that's not the case.

It's easy for me to cheer for the Cats, but it's hard to watch some times.

This team has no leader and it shows. No heart besides TJ out there. Tarc doesn't even look interested when he's in the game. Stanley doesn't look like the guy who was willing his high school team to all of those state titles.

etank34 wrote:This team has no leader and it shows. No heart besides TJ out there. Tarc doesn't even look interested when he's in the game. Stanley doesn't look like the guy who was willing his high school team to all of those state titles.

I see all the time that this team has no leader. Who is that on? Miller? The players? Both?

Think it is time for a player's only meeting where the decide who is the leader on this team (obvious choices being RHJ, TJ or SJ) and that person has to lead and everyone else has to follow.

The team needs to realize they aren't play an opponant. They are playing the name across the front of their own jersey. You can't go in and play like you're playing the Rebels or the Beavers. They aren't. Those shitty team cease to exist as soon as Arizona takes the floor. This is their Super Bowl, their Final Four. Arizona doesn't play against opponents, they play against the legend and legacy of Arizona.

Until they want to win more than the other team they will continue to tread water, occasionally slipping beneath the surface due to expectational undertow. If their jersey said Colorado, no opponant would give a shit. But it says Arizona, so until they play like it, other teams will be happy to continue to take them down a peg.

Start the game up
Play the game up
End the game up.

I expect more. The pieces are here. But the mentality of being unwilling to lose is missing. The unwillingness to not get beat is missing. The unwillingness to not make a mistake is missing.

This is why I'm so happy budd1e_lee is back, because he hit the nail on the head.

Absolutely zero urgency in tonight's loss. It's like some players expect "the process" to win games for them. Still have to go out there and execute.

I don't believe by any stretch that Miller didn't try to prepare them for Oregon State's defense, but this team lacks the patience to work for the win against such a school.

Gotta fight for everything now. A sweep this week is a must. We'll see who will respond. For the first time in a long time, I am pessimistic about some starters.

NETSFAN4HASSAN wrote:Idk who to put the blame on. Enough of it to go around.

I cannot understand why this team plays so methodical. When you have the supposed talent and athletes? We should really be trying to get as many possessions as possible.

I'm at a lost.

It's frustrating for sure. This was our lowest possession game of the season (54) and we never saw a press. OSU had a great gameplan. Use up as much shot clock as possible and clog the lane with a 2-3 zone. We responded by going 4-17 from 3, getting outrebounded (Our starting 4 and 5 had 3 rebounds combined) and letting them shoot 51%. A blueprint to beat Arizona.

NETSFAN4HASSAN wrote:Idk who to put the blame on. Enough of it to go around.

I cannot understand why this team plays so methodical. When you have the supposed talent and athletes? We should really be trying to get as many possessions as possible.

I'm at a lost.

nm...

I don't know what I'm talking about.

Been dealing with a sick kid all weekend, behind in work for tomorrow, and dead tired.

PJC had more rebounds than Kaleb

I think we all just have to lower expectations a bit for this team or else there's going to be a ton of broken remotes/outrage/venting...as we did last year around that bay trip/bAsh injury meltdown.

The reality is we lost arguably our 2 best players/athletes/defenders - they did so much more than what the stat sheet ever showed in terms of the level of intensity they brought - and those dudes brought it every damn game - and the leadership of specifically NJ. You don't just replace that - couple that with
-Our returning guys are playing at relatively the same level as last year, no one really has made a big jump in terms of production/value, you could even argue some have regressed a bit. Im especially disappointed in bash-his d is awful and he just doesn't bring any attitude to the table
-SJ is a talented guy, but in no way does he make up for NJ/AG loss for a lot of reasons

This team is not as talented, nor does it have as much heart as last years. I really don't see this group going further than the elite 8 and actually would be shocked if they made it that far. My expectations have def been lowered BUT it'll never be hard to cheer for the guys.

WildHolcs wrote:I think we all just have to lower expectations a bit for this team or else there's going to be a ton of broken remotes/outrage/venting...as we did last year around that bay trip/bAsh injury meltdown.

The reality is we lost arguably our 2 best players/athletes/defenders - they did so much more than what the stat sheet ever showed in terms of the level of intensity they brought - and those dudes brought it every damn game - and the leadership of specifically NJ. You don't just replace that - couple that with
-Our returning guys are playing at relatively the same level as last year, no one really has made a big jump in terms of production/value, you could even argue some have regressed a bit. Im especially disappointed in bash-his d is awful and he just doesn't bring any attitude to the table
-SJ is a talented guy, but in no way does he make up for NJ/AG loss for a lot of reasons

This team is not as talented, nor does it have as much heart as last years. I really don't see this group going further than the elite 8 and actually would be shocked if they made it that far. My expectations have def been lowered BUT it'll never be hard to cheer for the guys.

Ive been posting some of the exact same statements. Totally agree about having to make up for the losses of NJ and Gordon. Those guys were huge for us. And YES about returning players either regressing or staying the same. You can argue not one player has improved since last season.

Why was it that expectations were so high coming in? Not only from fans but from media, etc? Probably because they expected our returning players to improve enough to make up for the losses of NJ and Gordon. That just hasn't happened. Not even a little bit.

BASH and ZEUS should be men among boys out there at this point. But they seem to have gotten worse. Is it because of the pressure? Or are they just trying to showcase different skills for the league? Maybe they can turn it around.

But excellent post.

Agreed, I think the expectations for some of the returning players have yet to come to fruition. Most likely from being too optimistic or just overrating a few guys. Bash for instance, love the guy, but he is what he is a complimentary guy that is good at spacing the floor and has a nice touch who wasn't ever going to come in this year as a super athletic, aggressive, defensive/rebounding beast. Zeus seems comparable to last year and is still limited somewhat by the offense we run. TJ brings the heart/fire but still struggles with his 3/ft%. RHJ worked a ton on his shot in the off-season but it is still far from being anything reliable. York and Pitts are shooters but both are lacking in several key areas including D and size/athleticism/consistency. I guess if you mashed the two of them together you could have a pretty solid 2 guard. SJ brings some much needed offensive skills but still can't compensate for the losses of two amazing, key players. Combine all that with the fact NJ/AG made the game easier for some of these guys and your looking at a recipe to take a step back.

Just from an eye test (think I've seen every game besides 1)and not taking into account the numbers, analytics/metrics mumbo jumbo I think we went from an elite/excellent defense to a good defense. We no longer are a MASSIVE/beastly/dominating defense like last year that punished people for coming in the lane, were everywhere on the court, and just out rebounded the world. I also think we've taken a step back on the offensive side - mostly what stick out to me is the regression in transition hoops. Whether that be from AG blocking the shit out of someone/flying from out of nowhere for a board then starting his own break and making a sick pass to a slashing NJ/RHJ or from NJ picking someones pocket and taking it coast to coast - the transition/easy hoops seem to have dried up quite a bit - and in an offense that tends to struggle in the half court under miller, that's a big deal.

This team has a lot of room to grow and I'd like to see a lot more fire, just like TJ brings - like NJ/AG brought nightly. Sooner or later some of the guys need to grab their balls and play with some nastiness/intensity and start playing for each other. I've yet to see them really play as 1 cohesive unit, as a team that looks like everyones on the same page. I have hope but compared to last year I just don't see the same amount of talent out there.

Katzenfreund wrote:Stan still plays AAU ball most of the time. But that's because there's no leadership from our upperclassmen, besides TJ. Ashley, Tarczewski and York, guys who've been with the program for almost three years now, are mere followers that couldn't spark a stack of dry firewood. At this point, our leaderless assemblage of elite recruits is just a waste of high-profile talent. It might sound cruel and ungrateful, but we can only hope for Tarczewski and BAsh to depart for the league early. Maybe a clean cut and a fresh start is what we need the most with regard to next season.

What happen to "unfinished business" ?

Remember this sound bite from Tarc at the end of last season and to begin this season?

WildHolcs wrote:Agreed, I think the expectations for some of the returning players have yet to come to fruition. Most likely from being too optimistic or just overrating a few guys. Bash for instance, love the guy, but he is what he is a complimentary guy that is good at spacing the floor and has a nice touch who wasn't ever going to come in this year as a super athletic, aggressive, defensive/rebounding beast. Zeus seems comparable to last year and is still limited somewhat by the offense we run. TJ brings the heart/fire but still struggles with his 3/ft%. RHJ worked a ton on his shot in the off-season but it is still far from being anything reliable. York and Pitts are shooters but both are lacking in several key areas including D and size/athleticism/consistency. I guess if you mashed the two of them together you could have a pretty solid 2 guard. SJ brings some much needed offensive skills but still can't compensate for the losses of two amazing, key players. Combine all that with the fact NJ/AG made the game easier for some of these guys and your looking at a recipe to take a step back.

Just from an eye test (think I've seen every game besides 1)and not taking into account the numbers, analytics/metrics mumbo jumbo I think we went from an elite/excellent defense to a good defense. We no longer are a MASSIVE/beastly/dominating defense like last year that punished people for coming in the lane, were everywhere on the court, and just out rebounded the world. I also think we've taken a step back on the offensive side - mostly what stick out to me is the regression in transition hoops. Whether that be from AG blocking the shit out of someone/flying from out of nowhere for a board then starting his own break and making a sick pass to a slashing NJ/RHJ or from NJ picking someones pocket and taking it coast to coast - the transition/easy hoops seem to have dried up quite a bit - and in an offense that tends to struggle in the half court under miller, that's a big deal.

This team has a lot of room to grow and I'd like to see a lot more fire, just like TJ brings - like NJ/AG brought nightly. Sooner or later some of the guys need to grab their balls and play with some nastiness/intensity and start playing for each other. I've yet to see them really play as 1 cohesive unit, as a team that looks like everyones on the same page. I have hope but compared to last year I just don't see the same amount of talent out there.

Yep.^
I see RHJ (and TJ) freaking working their arses off every minute of the game and don't see others following. I see them for short stretches but that's it.

SJ is a disappointing to watch.

CalStateTempe wrote:SJ is a disappointing to watch.

Hate watching him gamble for steals and fail since then the Cats are defending 4 on 5

Glad to see this board is operating like the last.

Merkin wrote:

CalStateTempe wrote:SJ is a disappointing to watch.

Hate watching him gamble for steals and fail since then the Cats are defending 4 on 5

Another high-school all-star not buying fully into the process. The story of Arizona BB.

Olsondogg wrote:Glad to see this board is operating like the last.

Drama queen.

No way to spin that this wasn't a sh*tty loss.

So it was a shitty loss. Your point?

Olsondogg wrote:So it was a shitty loss. Your point?

Don't know how you can say that people are being overdramatic about it just for posting words to that effect.

There is alot more drama in this thread then commenting about a shitty loss. Much if it is melodramatic and stupid. If people can't get over a road loss in January, then that's on them.