Bear Down Wildcats

Having two very good QBs is a good problem to have.

Regardless of Noah's performance, as of three weeks ago, JDL hadn't progressed to the level he should have.

I think JDL was great last year and has the potential to be even better, but he wasn't getting it done.

For now it's Noah for sure. But JDL is a great athlete who played his heart out for us. We still need him to be onboard.

JDL has appeared in 32 games including his time with WSU.

Fifita has appeared in 9, with 6 of those being garbage time.

Could be freshman of the week again

Chicat wrote: ↑Mon Oct 16, 2023 8:24 am

TheCat wrote: ↑Mon Oct 16, 2023 6:54 am I don't think people remember what we were like when JDL committed.

And I don’t think that should matter one bit.

Yeah, when JDL transferred we were in the shitter. That doesn’t mean we should tolerate subpar play that keeps us from being great just because of the timing of that player committing.

No one is talking about forcing JDL to transfer again. But it’s obvious that Fifita is better in a whole host of ways. Should we put the better player on the bench and take a step back just because we used to be really bad?

I don't think JDL can transfer again. He had his free transfer when he came here but he's a junior and if he transfers he would lose a year of eligibility and he doesn't have it to lose now. He could enter the draft but I don't think his prospects in the draft are all that promising with so many quality QBs coming out this year. I wouldn't be upset at all next year with two quality QBs with experience in the stable. Sure as God made little green apples the starter is likely to be injured and miss a few games.

azcat49 wrote: ↑Mon Oct 16, 2023 10:21 am Could be freshman of the week again

And he is!

Dude is on Fire!!

Gotta be a rule about benching the 2 time defending freshman of the week, right?

The dude is just really good. Ride him to a bowl game.

Fifita is the present and the future.

Alieberman wrote: ↑Mon Oct 16, 2023 2:12 pm Gotta be a rule about benching the 2 time defending freshman of the week, right?

There is in my book. It's called the "Don't bench the 2 time defending freshman of the week" rule.

He’s got two weeks to win the job.

Simple as that.

wyo-cat wrote: ↑Mon Oct 16, 2023 3:51 pm He’s got two weeks to win the job.

Simple as that.

Who?

Feef has two weeks to win the job.

Let’s be honest here, he didn’t win it before JDL’s injury. If he did, he would be starting week one.

Has anyone on this board ever played football??

This isn't the first time a qb sucked at practice but balled out as a starter here at Arizona. Nick Foles didn't win the starting job but as soon as he came into the game he never went back out.

Players have to win their jobs during practice.

The team can’t prepare for the game otherwise.

Man, I battled at TOS for Nick to start over Matt.

Thank goodness he came back for RR’s first season. It was a perfect fit.

Chicat wrote: ↑Mon Oct 16, 2023 8:24 am

TheCat wrote: ↑Mon Oct 16, 2023 6:54 am I don't think people remember what we were like when JDL committed.

And I don’t think that should matter one bit.

Yeah, when JDL transferred we were in the shitter. That doesn’t mean we should tolerate subpar play that keeps us from being great just because of the timing of that player committing.

No one is talking about forcing JDL to transfer again. But it’s obvious that Fifita is better in a whole host of ways. Should we put the better player on the bench and take a step back just because we used to be really bad?

I think you are using the term "great" quite loosely. Nowhere in my post did I say who should be playing. JDL was the freshman offensive player of the league if my memory serves me right. That I would think required a little more than a 1-2 record although Fifita has played great. I don't pit our players against each other nor do I say one sucks.
I have seen this often on this site especially in the basketball forum. My thoughts about the success we have seen in this team is more related to the way the defense has played in the last 4 or so games. Let's hope that continues and that the team plays hard two weeks from now.

Fifita runs this offense like a conductor reads sheet music. He knows where everyone is and checks down accordingly and makes positive plays

JDL gets happy feet and dances around missing the last couple options and then try’s to make something happen off script that often leads to negative plays.

Our uptick is directly correlated to Fifita playing.

azcat49 wrote: ↑Mon Oct 16, 2023 5:55 pm Fifita runs this offense like a conductor reads sheet music. He knows where everyone is and checks down accordingly and makes positive plays

JDL gets happy feet and dances around missing the last couple options and then try’s to make something happen off script that often leads to negative plays.

Our uptick is directly correlated to Fifita playing.

This. 100%. Fifita will happily take a 6 yard check down on 1st and 10 or 2nd and 7. Keeps us on schedule and moving the ball. Fifita is also great at completing a 4 yard pass on 3rd and 2. Again, staying on schedule.

JDL is more of a gun slinger. He is far too often looking to make the big play and the result has been turnovers, or too many 2nd and 3rd and longs. And too many empty possessions.

Hard not to start Fifita. He is the better QB. If we're down and need a spark, we still have JDL in a spot where we need high reward, and the risk is minimal.

TheCat wrote: ↑Mon Oct 16, 2023 5:17 pm

Chicat wrote: ↑Mon Oct 16, 2023 8:24 am

TheCat wrote: ↑Mon Oct 16, 2023 6:54 am I don't think people remember what we were like when JDL committed.

And I don’t think that should matter one bit.

Yeah, when JDL transferred we were in the shitter. That doesn’t mean we should tolerate subpar play that keeps us from being great just because of the timing of that player committing.

No one is talking about forcing JDL to transfer again. But it’s obvious that Fifita is better in a whole host of ways. Should we put the better player on the bench and take a step back just because we used to be really bad?

I think you are using the term "great" quite loosely. Nowhere in my post did I say who should be playing. JDL was the freshman offensive player of the league if my memory serves me right. That I would think required a little more than a 1-2 record although Fifita has played great. I don't pit our players against each other nor do I say one sucks.
I have seen this often on this site especially in the basketball forum. My thoughts about the success we have seen in this team is more related to the way the defense has played in the last 4 or so games. Let's hope that continues and that the team plays hard two weeks from now.

The defense is miles ahead of where they were last year. It’s been an incredible turnaround.

But they didn’t put up 44 points and 500+ yards against a top-20 ranked team on the road.

Chicat wrote: ↑Mon Oct 16, 2023 8:08 pm

TheCat wrote: ↑Mon Oct 16, 2023 5:17 pm

Chicat wrote: ↑Mon Oct 16, 2023 8:24 am

TheCat wrote: ↑Mon Oct 16, 2023 6:54 am I don't think people remember what we were like when JDL committed.

And I don’t think that should matter one bit.

Yeah, when JDL transferred we were in the shitter. That doesn’t mean we should tolerate subpar play that keeps us from being great just because of the timing of that player committing.

No one is talking about forcing JDL to transfer again. But it’s obvious that Fifita is better in a whole host of ways. Should we put the better player on the bench and take a step back just because we used to be really bad?

I think you are using the term "great" quite loosely. Nowhere in my post did I say who should be playing. JDL was the freshman offensive player of the league if my memory serves me right. That I would think required a little more than a 1-2 record although Fifita has played great. I don't pit our players against each other nor do I say one sucks.
I have seen this often on this site especially in the basketball forum. My thoughts about the success we have seen in this team is more related to the way the defense has played in the last 4 or so games. Let's hope that continues and that the team plays hard two weeks from now.

The defense is miles ahead of where they were last year. It’s been an incredible turnaround.

But they didn’t put up 44 points and 500+ yards against a top-20 ranked team on the road.

Actually, the UA defense had a LOT to do with the 500+ yards and the 44 points. They forced multiple turnovers and 3 & outs which meant that the UA offense was on the field for a long time and had the opportunity to put up the points.

I personally don't believe that injuries should determine ones starters (especially at QB). I would much prefer a head to head competition.
What Fisch could do is to alternate JDL and Fifita on each UA offensive series. If one of the QB's significantly outplays the other by the middle of the 3rd quarter he could decide to go with the hot hand. I think it would be interesting to see how JDL would perform now that he has had the chance to watch the offense run from the sidelines.

And competition always brings out the best in competitors.

I also agree with the comments that the defense has been responsible for the bulk of the improvement in the team (not the QB) this year.

You cant discount how the long sustained drives of our O under Fifita have helped out our defense immensely. They are on the field much less with fresher legs.

This defense was not playing this way when JDL was qb.

AzCatFan2 wrote: ↑Mon Oct 16, 2023 7:26 pm
JDL is more of a gun slinger. He is far too often looking to make the big play and the result has been turnovers, or too many 2nd and 3rd and longs. And too many empty possessions.

Reminds me a lot of that crook Brett Favre in always trying to make the big play. Favre was just another turnover machine. Think I read that his last pass for every team he played for was a pick.

But Favre is one of the best NFL QBs ever, top 10 or 20. But he was a much better decision maker than JDL.


TD–INT: 508–336.

dmjcat wrote: ↑Mon Oct 16, 2023 9:18 pm

Chicat wrote: ↑Mon Oct 16, 2023 8:08 pm

TheCat wrote: ↑Mon Oct 16, 2023 5:17 pm

Chicat wrote: ↑Mon Oct 16, 2023 8:24 am

TheCat wrote: ↑Mon Oct 16, 2023 6:54 am I don't think people remember what we were like when JDL committed.

And I don’t think that should matter one bit.

Yeah, when JDL transferred we were in the shitter. That doesn’t mean we should tolerate subpar play that keeps us from being great just because of the timing of that player committing.

No one is talking about forcing JDL to transfer again. But it’s obvious that Fifita is better in a whole host of ways. Should we put the better player on the bench and take a step back just because we used to be really bad?

I think you are using the term "great" quite loosely. Nowhere in my post did I say who should be playing. JDL was the freshman offensive player of the league if my memory serves me right. That I would think required a little more than a 1-2 record although Fifita has played great. I don't pit our players against each other nor do I say one sucks.
I have seen this often on this site especially in the basketball forum. My thoughts about the success we have seen in this team is more related to the way the defense has played in the last 4 or so games. Let's hope that continues and that the team plays hard two weeks from now.

The defense is miles ahead of where they were last year. It’s been an incredible turnaround.

But they didn’t put up 44 points and 500+ yards against a top-20 ranked team on the road.

Actually, the UA defense had a LOT to do with the 500+ yards and the 44 points. They forced multiple turnovers and 3 & outs which meant that the UA offense was on the field for a long time and had the opportunity to put up the points.

The defense didn’t keep the offense on the field for those long drives and didn’t put up all those points. They could have gotten twice the turnovers and 3&outs but if Fifita and the offense turn the ball right back over or produce their own 3&outs it wouldn’t much matter.

It’s ok to acknowledge that the offense is clicking in a way that it didn’t under JDL, even if you are a fan of the kid. To me the competition has already been won by Noah.

In the past our offensive drives required some big plays to garner points because without turnovers we were always working with a long field.

The turnovers make it easier for the offense obviously to get into the red zone but what I loved seeing was the more balanced, controlled drives that I think Fifita is more equipped to handle.

And the more ball control we can sustain each game it will only benefit a defense that has more depth and is vastly improved.

The defense holding a high scoring team to 6 points made all the sifference in the world. The defense is vastly improved this year, but until this game were still allowing too many long drives and points scored. Coupled with the offense regressing somewhat this year that put us in a hole early in games.

I love how Fifita is playing but, without what the defense did, he would have been playing catch-up all game instead of playing with a lead, which would have affected the play calling.

I will go with the coaches on this one. Whoever they go with, Fifita or De Laura, I have no quarrel. I suspect strongly that they know more about the team and the players than anyone on this board. So they are in the best position to make the decision.

32nd in total defense with 332.9 yards allowed per game
https://www.ncaa.com/stats/football/fbs/current/team/22

36th in scoring defense with 20.57 points allowed per game
https://www.ncaa.com/stats/football/fbs/current/team/28

13th in rushing defense with 96.0 yards allowed per game
https://www.ncaa.com/stats/football/fbs/current/team/24

We're a good defense this year.

All last year we were all saying "if our defense was just middle of the road we'd be in great shape". Well.....we're better than middle of the road.

Kind of interesting that we have this Noah/JDL back and forth but we don’t talk much about Wiley/ Coleman.

I know the RB position is by committee where the QB is more locked in but Coleman to me has also gone to RB #1

Coleman is a beast and a hell of a lot better receiver than I thought. Wiley is great too but short yardage should always be Coleman.

BBQ wildcat wrote: ↑Tue Oct 17, 2023 11:26 am The defense holding a high scoring team to 6 points made all the sifference in the world. The defense is vastly improved this year, but until this game were still allowing too many long drives and points scored. Coupled with the offense regressing somewhat this year that put us in a hole early in games.

I love how Fifita is playing but, without what the defense did, he would have been playing catch-up all game instead of playing with a lead, which would have affected the play calling.

I will go with the coaches on this one. Whoever they go with, Fifita or De Laura, I have no quarrel. I suspect strongly that they know more about the team and the players than anyone on this board. So they are in the best position to make the decision.

I definitely need to watch the games closer. Unforgivable of me to miss the D-Line throwing for 350 yards, the LBs garnering a 145 QBR, and the DBs orchestrating drives that produced double digit points in every quarter.

It's a team game. The D getting turnovers and 3 and outs helps the O. The O having long drives and converting on 3rd downs helping the D rest helps the D. We were 10-17 on 3rd down, and 1-1 on 4th down. In contrast, WSU was 4-11 on 3rd down, and 0-3 on 4th down. Throw in a +3 stat on turnovers, and that's how you get a dominating blow out.

Fifita was instrumental in helping get the 26 first downs we had. It's hard to say what JDL would have done, but historically, JDL takes too many deep shots on 1st down or on 3rd down when a short check down would keep us on schedule on 1st down, or get us a 1st down. It's high risk, high reward, and Fifita now turning the ball over is a plus. As the saying goes, it's best to end every drive with some sort of kick...unless you go for 2. The only time we didn't end a drive with a kick was the end of the game. Otherwise, it was one punt, plus a bunch of scoring drives.

Fifita simply makes better decisions and reads his progressions at a higher level than JDL. We may not have as many huge plays with Fifita, but we also won't have as many turnovers, and likely have more sustained drives with multiple first downs. To me, this makes Fifita the better option at QB, unless he's struggling, we're losing, and we need a guy who isn't risk adverse to make a play.

I definitely like Fifita. Tough little dude with a shitload of moxie.

But I definitely think JDLs ceiling is higher-if he can get there.

TheCat wrote: ↑Tue Oct 17, 2023 1:39 pm Coleman is a beast and a hell of a lot better receiver than I thought. Wiley is great too but short yardage should always be Coleman.

That was the Stoops' MO. Run 5'6" Keola Antolin up the middle near the goal line when you have EMFM sitting in the sidelines.

Just like Fisch's is run a pitchout to the left side near the goal line. Similar results to his trick plays which work maybe 10% of the time.

Carcassdragger wrote: ↑Tue Oct 17, 2023 2:03 pm I definitely like Fifita. Tough little dude with a shitload of moxie.

But I definitely think JDLs ceiling is higher-if he can get there.

I think we've seen JDL's ceiling.

JDL is slightly taller, has better wheels, probably a stronger arm, but his decision making is marginal at best. Maybe a better NFL prospect than Fifita, but CFB is not a minor league for the NFL in terms of getting players ready for the pros.

You guys should definitely watch Jedd's pressor from yesterday. He talked up the defense the whole time and says the offense is still down from last year. He was very non-committal about who would be the qb for our next game and talked about how the 2 are best friends.

It’s funny how CJF still follows the NFL. He recited what was happening with the Cleveland Browns QB situation.

I imagine he has his eye on getting back there. No recruiting hassles and NCAA headaches to deal with.

I know assistant coaches jump around a lot, but the longest he has ever stayed at a place is 3 years, and since 2008 he has been at 10 different places.

This list is very sus but I’m going to prop up Fifita whenever I can.

Haha Caleb no where in sight.

No way is that list legit if Graham Mertz is on it

Any chance it is for week 7 only?

Edit - I think last week was week 7?

Fishclamps wrote: ↑Wed Oct 18, 2023 4:08 pm No way is that list legit if Graham Mertz is on it

That's what I was thinking.

Chicat wrote: ↑Tue Oct 17, 2023 1:45 pm

BBQ wildcat wrote: ↑Tue Oct 17, 2023 11:26 am The defense holding a high scoring team to 6 points made all the sifference in the world. The defense is vastly improved this year, but until this game were still allowing too many long drives and points scored. Coupled with the offense regressing somewhat this year that put us in a hole early in games.

I love how Fifita is playing but, without what the defense did, he would have been playing catch-up all game instead of playing with a lead, which would have affected the play calling.

I will go with the coaches on this one. Whoever they go with, Fifita or De Laura, I have no quarrel. I suspect strongly that they know more about the team and the players than anyone on this board. So they are in the best position to make the decision.

I definitely need to watch the games closer. Unforgivable of me to miss the D-Line throwing for 350 yards, the LBs garnering a 145 QBR, and the DBs orchestrating drives that produced double digit points in every quarter.

I think you need to watch the games with a less biased eye. Every defensive stop kept the opposition from scoring points AND gave us a possession we otherwise wouldn't have had. The stop on 4th down, the turnovers, 3 and outs most likely gave our offense 2-3 more possessions than we otherwise would have had. Less opportunities for us, coupled with the points that may have been scored without those stops, could well have been the deciding factor. Not to mention, we were playing being ahed just about all gme and not struggling to play catch up. That is why Fisch was heaping so much praise on the defense. I'm just not sure why you don't see it.

Think of how much we would have won by if we had punted on first down.

New strategy!

Now THAT was a truly idiotic comment. What does that even mean? I think I need some of what you are drinking or smoking

BBQ wildcat wrote: ↑Wed Oct 18, 2023 5:42 pm

Chicat wrote: ↑Tue Oct 17, 2023 1:45 pm

BBQ wildcat wrote: ↑Tue Oct 17, 2023 11:26 am The defense holding a high scoring team to 6 points made all the sifference in the world. The defense is vastly improved this year, but until this game were still allowing too many long drives and points scored. Coupled with the offense regressing somewhat this year that put us in a hole early in games.

I love how Fifita is playing but, without what the defense did, he would have been playing catch-up all game instead of playing with a lead, which would have affected the play calling.

I will go with the coaches on this one. Whoever they go with, Fifita or De Laura, I have no quarrel. I suspect strongly that they know more about the team and the players than anyone on this board. So they are in the best position to make the decision.

I definitely need to watch the games closer. Unforgivable of me to miss the D-Line throwing for 350 yards, the LBs garnering a 145 QBR, and the DBs orchestrating drives that produced double digit points in every quarter.

I think you need to watch the games with a less biased eye. Every defensive stop kept the opposition from scoring points AND gave us a possession we otherwise wouldn't have had. The stop on 4th down, the turnovers, 3 and outs most likely gave our offense 2-3 more possessions than we otherwise would have had. Less opportunities for us, coupled with the points that may have been scored without those stops, could well have been the deciding factor. Not to mention, we were playing being ahed just about all gme and not struggling to play catch up. That is why Fisch was heaping so much praise on the defense. I'm just not sure why you don't see it.

Agreed.

Its actually pretty simple. When your defense is forcing turnovers & 3 & outs your offense spends more time on the field.....which directly leads to more yards offense and points. I think most people see that.

dmjcat wrote: ↑Wed Oct 18, 2023 6:22 pm

BBQ wildcat wrote: ↑Wed Oct 18, 2023 5:42 pm

Chicat wrote: ↑Tue Oct 17, 2023 1:45 pm

BBQ wildcat wrote: ↑Tue Oct 17, 2023 11:26 am The defense holding a high scoring team to 6 points made all the sifference in the world. The defense is vastly improved this year, but until this game were still allowing too many long drives and points scored. Coupled with the offense regressing somewhat this year that put us in a hole early in games.

I love how Fifita is playing but, without what the defense did, he would have been playing catch-up all game instead of playing with a lead, which would have affected the play calling.

I will go with the coaches on this one. Whoever they go with, Fifita or De Laura, I have no quarrel. I suspect strongly that they know more about the team and the players than anyone on this board. So they are in the best position to make the decision.

I definitely need to watch the games closer. Unforgivable of me to miss the D-Line throwing for 350 yards, the LBs garnering a 145 QBR, and the DBs orchestrating drives that produced double digit points in every quarter.

I think you need to watch the games with a less biased eye. Every defensive stop kept the opposition from scoring points AND gave us a possession we otherwise wouldn't have had. The stop on 4th down, the turnovers, 3 and outs most likely gave our offense 2-3 more possessions than we otherwise would have had. Less opportunities for us, coupled with the points that may have been scored without those stops, could well have been the deciding factor. Not to mention, we were playing being ahed just about all gme and not struggling to play catch up. That is why Fisch was heaping so much praise on the defense. I'm just not sure why you don't see it.

Agreed.

Its actually pretty simple. When your defense is forcing turnovers & 3 & outs your offense spends more time on the field.....which directly leads to more yards offense and points. I think most people see that.

"Most"people. I am in no way diminishing what the offense did. Very solid performance, with good time-consuming drives. As the saying goes "it was a team effort". But what the defense did was several steps above what it has been able to do all year, to this point. If they can keep it up like this past game, we are a very, very good team.

Fishclamps wrote: ↑Wed Oct 18, 2023 4:08 pm No way is that list legit if Graham Mertz is on it

It is a POWER ratings list.

I don't know why we are all arguing about this, both the defense and offense are in synergy with each other. Defense getting 3 and outs or forcing turnovers gives the offense more opportunities, and the offense sustaining long drives that end with points take a lot of pressure off the defense and let them rest in-between series.

This type of total overall game was not present when JDL was qb because he squandered opportunities (no points and TOs) and therefore made the defense work harder than they should have, which probably left them gassed by the end of games.